Love Your Sales

Simplifying Business Connections

The "Love Your Sales" podcast hosted by Leighann Lovely features a deep dive into the struggles and solutions for small business owners and entrepreneurs. In this episode, Leighann interviews Scott LeBeau, a former banking professional turned entrepreneur, who discusses the challenges faced by small businesses. Scott shares insights on his platform, OneSourceDirect, which aims to level the playing field for small businesses by connecting them directly with potential clients without the disadvantages imposed by traditional marketing and search engine constraints. The conversation highlights Scott's passion for helping small businesses and the significance of simplifying marketing efforts. Additionally, the episode touches on the importance of learning from failures and the rise of entrepreneurship since COVID-19.
Contact Scott
Website - www.Onesourcedirect.net  
Email - scott@onesourcedirect.net
 
Special Thank you to our Sponsors – Genhead – www.genhead.com and Sales Rescue – www.rescuemysales.com
Robb Conlon – Intro and outro – Westport Studio - https://www.westportstudiosllc.com/
The Brave Ones – Instrumental Version Song by Jan Sanejko - https://artlist.io/royalty-free-music/song/the-brave-ones/119489
Ready to grow your business? Schedule a call with us today  - https://api.leadconnectorhq.com/widget/bookings/discoverysalesleighann 
Leighann Lovely: Welcome to another episode of Love Your Sales. I am joined today by Scott LeBow. He has got 35 years in the banking industry, working with small to mid size as well as large, Working with large businesses as well. Is that correct, Scott?
Scott LeBeau: Yeah, I've, I've had a couple, but mostly they've been smaller businesses or a lot of consumers and car dealerships, things like that, so.
Leighann Lovely: Awesome. And he is now the owner, the [00:02:00] founder of OneSourceDirect. And, I am thrilled to have him join me today and, , walk me, walk us through, um, his journey into entrepreneurship. So welcome, Scott. I am so thrilled to have you join me today.
Scott LeBeau: Thanks a lot. I appreciate it. Yeah. It's as you know, cause we've had so many side conversation.
It's, it's interesting. We'll use that word today. Okay.
Leighann Lovely: Oh, right. We will use interesting, but Scott, I'm excited to have, like I said, I'm excited to have you come on because you and I have had a lot of side conversations around, um, one source direct and what it does for people. Let's dive a little bit into that because, , it truly is an amazing platform.
So let's talk about that. Okay.
Scott LeBeau: All right. Are you okay if I use your story that I posted on a few weeks ago about your search for the accountant?
Leighann Lovely: Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Let's talk about that.
Scott LeBeau: I think that just really kind of sums up very well what we're trying to do. [00:03:00] And you know, you had mentioned that you were looking for that accountant and you'd spend three plus days looking for one and really had no, no responses or very limited responses and What we're trying to do is make it so that you could have taken that three day journey and put in the 15 minutes.
And so you could have simply used our platform said, I'm going to go out there. I'm going to look for an accountant. I can create the need form, a little description, what you're looking for, timeframe, just some basic things. And then the minute you hit submit, it goes Directly to any account that's on our platform and it really benefits you because it saves time on your end.
But, you know, when you look at that accountant on the back end that might not have a marketing budget is going to appear on page 15 of the internet searches and things like that, that no one ever looks at. So it's really a way of trying to connect that buyer and seller directly with each other in as easy as as easy as possible process we can put together that makes sense.
But again, it's just a simplified way to connect people.
Leighann Lovely: So it's, um, free [00:04:00] for, that would have been free for me or.
Scott LeBeau: Yes, that part would have been free for you. In fact, if anyone wants, they can go up, go out there and sign up today. Uh, just go to our website, but right for you, it's free, for the account.
They do pay a monthly subscription. And when, you know, with our platform, that subscription is one price for everything that we offer. So even though we have two platforms, every time you want to, you know, send something out, you don't have to pay another charge and create a new campaign. So it's just a much again, simpler, hopefully process for people.
Leighann Lovely: Well, that sounds that sounds amazing. So I, as a small business could put my information out there, explain to the world what I do. And then they, all of the people out there who are on there for free, put out what they are possibly searching for as far as needs. And then I'm advertised directly to them when their need comes up.
Scott LeBeau: Right? Yeah, they connect directly with you. Um, the other thing you could take like [00:05:00] our podcast today and you could actually push that out to people that are looking for, you know, marketing or business development tips. So it's really way about creating a 2 way flow of information so that as a user and in a recent poll we did, we found out that 70 percent of the business owners spend.
More than 11 hours a week on the internet looking for things. Well, this is a way to give them back part of that time, so it comes directly to them. It benefits you from the perspective of, you're trying to reach that customer ultimately. Um, and for them, it's like, you know what, it just shows up in my inbox whenever you post something.
So they can stay up to date on things without really having to invest a great deal of time and effort.
Leighann Lovely: But it, it's information that I want to see.
Scott LeBeau: Yes. You, you pick and choose what offers you want to receive, which could just be, let's say you're going to run a free marketing, what, you know, website analysis or something like that.
So it could be an offer. It could be an article like your podcast right here. You can send that to somebody that says, I want this type of information.
Leighann Lovely: That's awesome. [00:06:00] Okay. Because I mean, on a regular basis, I'm getting spammed by, So much information and honestly, I got to be, you know, realistic if I'm not interested in the information, it goes directly into my delete, delete, delete.
But when I am looking for that information, it feels like it's impossible to find
Scott LeBeau: it. You're right there. It's just a sea of information out there. Like one of my friends always said, it's like drinking water through a fire hose. You're just getting inundated with too much stuff and you stop looking because you don't have time to sift through everything.
So it's kind of like we're helping you unsubscribe before you even try to subscribe. So.
Leighann Lovely: Okay. And so let's, let's go back to the beginning. You've, you've had 35 years in the banking industry and then all of a sudden what you decide to just jump into entrepreneurship. Let's talk about that.
Scott LeBeau: I just woke up one morning and felt the need to change.
Actually partially where this came from is, you know, I've done my internet searches for things that I've had to do for the bank, whether [00:07:00] looking for products or services, whatever. And as a user, I've been inundated with too spammed, like you said before. Also, next thing you know, you're getting unwanted phone calls, emails, pop ups, all this other stuff.
Those are all things that we don't do. Um, so between that and also sitting down and actually working with several business owners that, you know, you hear their stories and you hear the struggles that they have. And I can't tell you how many times I've heard somebody say, you know, I just need that one customer to get me over the hump.
You know, um, So it was partially that, and several business owners, in fact, that I've actually worked with actually closing their businesses are some of the people that helped us put this together. so it's, it's been that and, you know, the, there's a catch 22 in banking. It says, you know, if you have a newer business looking for, you know, hey, I need a loan.
Okay, well, I can't approve your loan because you don't have revenue to pay me back. Okay, but then the customer looks and goes, that's why I wanted the money so [00:08:00] I can invest in marketing so I could get revenue to pay you back. So it really does create some very awkward conversations when, you know, people are just trying to, you know, get, get over the hump and you can't even help them with that.
So it really is about several, several experiences, both personally and professionally that I've dealt with. And, rather than just sitting on the sidelines, I, I talked to the people I knew in business and I talked to some friends that are developers and we sat in, um, in a conference room for, By six or seven straight weeks, you know, like once or twice a week, and this is what we came up with
Leighann Lovely: interesting.
And you're so right. I mean, the number one reason small businesses fails because they run out of money and they can't get a loan from a bank if the bank doesn't feel that they're viable enough to be able to pay them back. And you all of a sudden you're like, I just need like 50, 000 and I will be able to launch my business and I will be able to pay you back.
Like trust me. And they're like, yeah, we don't, we don't loan money to people when they [00:09:00] just say, trust me.
Scott LeBeau: Right. Yeah. Yeah. Character does count, but it has a limit. Um, but you know, you think, or think about that customer that, you know, okay, I have a customer that wants me, is going to give me a million dollar contract if I can develop this product.
Well, if you can't develop the product, you're kissing that, you know, million dollar deal goodbye. So it's, it's tough. And like I said, I've, I've heard a lot of stories over the course of my. Uh, many, many years, decades or whatever of banking, but you know, when you boil it down, it really does come down to the same thing.
Leighann Lovely: Right. Right. That makes sense. I mean, as an entrepreneur myself, who's, you know, sat and gone, man, if I could just get that revenue up, I could go to the bank. They would give me money and then I would be, you know, set to be able to get over that hump. But you are completely correct. It all comes down to. How do you get the next customer to get you over that hump?
Scott LeBeau: Right. And you know, even from a startup perspective to the, you [00:10:00] know, that's really in a lot of cases where you have to invest that money because with current or a lot of the social media platforms, you really need to figure out a way to get to page one or two, since so many people never go past that.
And it's an expense that not a lot of people can take on, you know, and when you look at COVID, how many people, you know, What it's been almost 4 million businesses, uh, since COVID has started. Well, how many started up because they, they were downsized out, you know, so some of these people, it's not been by choice, but they're at a competitive disadvantage from the word go.
It's not like you left their experiences with their employer. Hey, I'm downsizing you, but, uh, take everything, you know, and put it on this disc and then leave, you know, And, and unfortunately, the social media platforms will, they can actually, what do you call it? Their rating is, uh, the algorithm is based on their number of years in business.
And if you don't meet that minimum requirement, there's no way you're getting to page one. No one's going to find you. So we treat everyone the same. [00:11:00] Everyone has an equal chance to generate a lead, to promote their business through the different channels. In fact, just by signing up for our paid plans, you automatically are eligible to start beginning to start receiving leads.
You don't have to do any marketing or promotion. So
Leighann Lovely: that's, it feels like that would be such just a simple, why wouldn't I do that?
Scott LeBeau: Well, you know, we talked before about branding and getting your name out there. That's the same. A lot of the challenges I saw with these other people are the exact same ones I'm going through right now and just figuring out, you know, how do you, how do you convey your message in a very simple way?
And, as you know, we've tried many different things and changing the message to try to figure out how can I resonate that message or our message, better with somebody so that they know that we're there and, um, it's a challenge.
Leighann Lovely: Right, so it comes down to what makes you, your community, your platform, different [00:12:00] than the other platforms out there, because there are, I mean, there's what, uh, there's, I mean, I can name, Alignable, there's, but those are communities where You have to continue to
Scott LeBeau: contribute and add people and things of that nature.
And with us, you know, built, we understand that and recognize that building a network is not a, it's not an easy task. And I kind of look at, I jokingly, and I don't know if it's good or bad, but I think sometimes some other platforms like pyramid scheming, because they, you know, they ask you to go out and help other people, you know, build their pro, you know, products.
So you can have access to their. You know, they're members and then you expect people to do that for you. So it's, it's kind of a different approach. But we want a community built where that just by signing up, you become a part of that community. You have access to the community, you know, and you can control the information that you receive.
You're not going to get hit with, you know, unwanted phone calls, spam and [00:13:00] pop up ads or any of that stuff, because those are not things that we believe in. You know, again, it's, those are things that put, you know, One business ahead of another one. They, they rewarded the people that have the resources, the, experience or the capabilities to run extensive campaigns.
And, and there's so many people that have great. Business ideas that have great products and services, but they, they're, they can't be found because they don't have the money or the experience that they need or the time to, to really go out and promote your business art.
Leighann Lovely: Right. And, and you think about that and you go online and you, Let's just say, and I know Scott, you've heard me use this one before, but the plumber is of the world, right?
But, so you type in plumber, and the ones that can pay to advertise on any, on any search engine. Will come up at the top and you can see they're, they're paid advertisers. So they pop up at the top, [00:14:00] which means that it is an unfair advantage to those small guys out there. Usually the ones that are local run businesses, non chain, but true.
And not to say that, you know, a franchise or a chain is not a locally run or owned business, but. But they're the ones that don't have that mass financial backing of. You know, a franchise or of a, you know, huge business marketing,
Scott LeBeau: marketing,
Leighann Lovely: marketing department. And so because they don't have that backing, they struggle to ever get off the ground.
Right. And if you want to support local, you know, and sometimes you don't even realize that you're not, if you're just, you know, pointing at the, or just clicking on the first one that you see, and you think, Oh, serving Milwaukee. Okay. I, cause I would love to be able to support local. I want to support the community that I live in.
It [00:15:00] would be nice to level the playing field. And it sounds like your platform. Puts everybody on the same.
Scott LeBeau: It doesn't, it doesn't matter to us. And you know, the example we can use as your accountant, if you would, you know, do an internet search without naming names, you get 459 million accountants near us.
Now, I don't know about you, but I've evidently missed that subdivision because there is not that many. And you're right. You, even if you join a group, let's say on LinkedIn, you know, okay, local businesses, how many of those people actually reside here? You know, and people are joining things like that, you know, that's our thing.
We don't have groups or hashtags, none of that. This is all just, um, it's not very, it's not a very exciting platform to look at, but that's by design. It's designed to be simple. It's designed to be one that doesn't require that you take multiple classes, run multiple campaigns, all these different things.
It is just one where literally you can go on, you create your profile, you [00:16:00] can go back in and manage at any time, and then. You set the radius. So if I only want to do business with, you know, somebody within 10 miles of me, that's what, that's what we'll come down to. You set where you want to do your business.
If you want to do global, have Adder, you know.
Leighann Lovely: Right.
Scott LeBeau: So it's really up to your personal preferences. And we felt that there were just different ways to do things like that.
Leighann Lovely: Amazing. And that's, and that's great. I mean, and ultimately, so even if the big dogs come on there, even if Amazon or whatever it might be comes on there, they still don't have more pull than the little, Mom and pop shop candle company down the road who's saying yeah here I've got great Christmas gifts if that's what you're setting your preferences to be for whatever it might be
Scott LeBeau: right.
Yeah, exactly I mean it it just seems like that made sense and maybe I oversimplified things because But I think that we have some, we have power through [00:17:00] simplicity and what we built.
Leighann Lovely: And I think that entrepreneurs today are looking for something simple in a very complex world. Because we, we get lost in the complexities, don't we?
Scott LeBeau: Right. I think that one of the biggest challenges, and you and I've talked about this, is that we face is education. And I don't mean how to use us, but people are so conditioned, like, you know, all the social media platforms out there, you're so conditioned that I have to do this, this, this, spend this, do and all these different things when the reality is, I don't think you do, you know, a lot of their decisions, you know, changing algorithms daily, you know, how can you, how can you keep up with that?
You know, you have to pay somebody to do that, you know, Really, I think in a lot of cases, the small business customers that we hope to be able to help are ones that, um, are kind of left by the wayside, you know, by some of these people, because they're not going to generate 5, 000 a month in revenue or 1, 000 a month in revenue.
If as a business owner, I can [00:18:00] afford 100 a month, well, okay, that's one hour of work. Maybe I can get out of a consultant, you know, so I think that there's a market and there's a great opportunity here, to support us. I think an underserved, segment of the workforce, which accounts for 99. 9 percent of the business in the country.
So, so yeah,
Leighann Lovely: very interesting. So when you started coming up with this idea, you had mentioned that there was a group of you that kind of talked about this, where, I mean, how did, how did the first thing that You, I think you kind of mentioned that, that because you were in banking and you were seeing so many underserved, you know, businesses that, and that would be painful.
I mean, it would be seeing, seeing so many people that you weren't able to help. And, you know, I understand the regulations in banking. I understand, you know, that there's a certain thresholds that you have to be able to show in order for it to be a viable, deal to [00:19:00] give some, you can't just give anybody money or, you know, the.
The banking industry would, would fold. And we've, we've seen, you know, what back in the housing industry when they were handing out loans to everybody, we, we saw that happen, but, so I get that, but you know, at what point did you really decide like, yeah, I'm going to, I'm going to jump both feet in on this.
And what was,
Scott LeBeau: what was that like?
Leighann Lovely: What was that like? And you know, what did you have family that were like, you're crazy. Cause I know my family was like, you're crazy.
Scott LeBeau: I don't know if they thought I was crazy, but I always call it the deer in the headlight look because I remember as I started conceptualizing this and I actually met with, you know, some of our vendors that we had at the bank as well, I would sit there and I explained to him and it'd be like this pause.
And I remember one gentleman, he had his computer out and he's looking at some stuff that we'd put out there and he's just like staring at it and I'm like, is everything okay? You know, I didn't know what it was, [00:20:00] but I think, you know, and things like that at first, I was like, yeah, what do I have to do differently?
I'm like, you know what I said, it goes back to what I said about education. We, what we've built is so different than what's out there. You know that. And again, everyone's trained to think about something in a specific way. So when you throw something out there that challenges, you know, the norm. Yeah.
 It made people think I, I said that if, if 10 percent of the people that I've ever talked about this told me I was crazy and I should, you know, check myself in for a long weekend, I would have stopped years ago. But I think that, you know, the more I talk to people, but what we're trying to do, I get so much positive feedback.
In fact, through these initial conversations, you know, our core platform exists today. We already have seven enhancements that we've already gotten from conversations with people about how do I take this to the next level? How do I make this even better, more efficient for everybody involved? Um, so it's really, it's so much fun when people start to figure out what we're doing and how we're doing it.
[00:21:00] And, you know, like I mentioned before we hopped on the call today, I said, you know, our conversation today led me to go back and really kind of revisit the why what we've done, you know, and it really, it's fun, you know, to, to sit down and think about this because, so it's so easy and I'm sure I've done have an idea that you're like, that's just too much work, you know, and you're not going to go against it.
Scott LeBeau: And if you really kind of look at the people or the companies I'm going against, I think the interest they earn on their checking account per second is probably, you know, because they're so big. You know, and they, everything that they do is designed to, to increase profits. You know, they have, they have a board, a board of directors.
We don't, we have end users. My end users are more important to me than a board of directors ever will be. Because they're the ones that are going to tell us what they need. They're the ones that we're going to talk to about how we make this better for you. You know, simple things, you know, what do you want to see?
What are your pain points? I mean, all these things you can go out and research on the internet if you have the time, effort, and desire to do so. [00:22:00] But until you actually, I think, sit across from somebody, you know, And really kind of listen to them. It really doesn't hit home. And I think every business that I shut down, I did it face to face.
I had personal conversations with these people. I would be sitting there talking to things as, you know, their spouses, their children, their family came walking in. So it was very real for me. It's not something I did via, uh, which surprised some of the people I worked with. I didn't do it over the phone. I didn't do it via email or text or anything like that.
And I think that's because I think people may talk to me, understand the passion I have for this. I think they know that it would take a lot to get me off center and to stop doing what I'm doing.
Leighann Lovely: That was really well said. And clearly you do have a passion for helping people and wow, that was really, really well said.
Thanks.
Scott LeBeau: Again, this is fun for me. I mean, I, this is something I'll hit mandatory retirement age soon, but I go, this is something I'm going to do well past it because I [00:23:00] just enjoy this. I enjoy sitting down and talking to people.
Leighann Lovely: Right. Well, and you know, if If you enjoy what you do, you'll never, you know, work a day in your life.
And I think that the rise of the small business and the entrepreneurs, , you know, that we've seen, it comes out of a place of passion in so many of us, right. You know, and the amount you had said, the, the amount of new entrepreneurs since COVID has, It's insane. It's insane. Right.
Right. It is absolutely insane. And to have a platform where we are all working together and not fighting each other, that's what, that's what this is.
Scott LeBeau: Right. And you know, you think about some of the platforms that, you know, cause freelancers are the same way. They're going to grow exponentially over the next several years.
Well, you can go to some websites out there now and they'll take up to 40 percent of the money. That you earn as a freelancer, just for the, you know, connecting through there, they're going to [00:24:00] restrict, you know, you and I could be, I could be in the US, you could be across the border in Canada, have the same skill set, but because you're in Canada, some of these websites will limit what you can potentially earn, you know, our goal is really to Get people talking.
Yes.
Leighann Lovely: Let's go back to that. Say that again. I'm sorry. Go back to that.
Scott LeBeau: Some of the, some of the freelancer websites that are out there will limit how much a person can make based upon their geographic location. So in addition to taking up to 40 percent of what you're going to earn, they're also going to, they, several may restrict the max you can earn because you're in X, Y, Z country.
Leighann Lovely: Is that legal?
Scott LeBeau: It must be because these, these, these people have, uh, I'm sure a few attorneys working for him. So, yeah, but that's, that's it, you know, and so much
Leighann Lovely: is that that's a state or federal. It's got to be a federal,
Scott LeBeau: we have international rules, international
Leighann Lovely: rules because of, and so the government is [00:25:00] going to, uh, notice
Scott LeBeau: the systems themselves actually do.
They limited
Leighann Lovely: systems.
Scott LeBeau: Yes. And the key thing there is, is that as long as you treat everybody the same. There's really not much you can do
Leighann Lovely: interesting,
Scott LeBeau: but things like that. So we want to be able to say, okay, you know, we're going to do, we're going to connect you to, if you both agree that you want to go forward.
And again, your initial contact for the most part on the platform is anonymous. So nobody knows who you are. You can even communicate and ask questions on someone sends you a lead. You can go back and forth anonymously, but once you decide to go forward, then it's up to you to make your deal. I'm not going to set prices.
I'm not going to take a cut of what you do. And things like that. And the other thing that we do, and this kind of goes back to that level playing field, what we have on the platform is the ability to identify as a, let's say a woman owned business, uh, Latino, Hispanic, black owned LGBTQ. You can identify that because there's so many people that support those groups.
So you have, and these are all things that we did without talking, you know, [00:26:00] that's, those are not things that we discuss with the groups, but those are things that we just did because they seem to make sense.
Leighann Lovely: Right. Well, yeah. I mean, and there's a lot of people out there who, Choose to support and and to be anonymous that that eliminates in the beginning the some of the discrimination, some of the discrimination, or I mean, hey, I'd love to look at a couple of different offers, before I then want to get to know the person. To make sure that I know, like, and trust them.
Scott LeBeau: Right. And, and so once let's say as a seller and I get your lead, the minute that I click interested, then my profile opens up that you create that also includes any of the offers, articles, anything that you're, you posted.
But I still don't know who the, you know, the customers or the buyer is.
Leighann Lovely: So you can't be harassed by them.
Scott LeBeau: Right.
Leighann Lovely: If you choose not to move forward, they're not going to spam you.
Scott LeBeau: Right. Just like [00:27:00] if the person that gets a lead says, I'm not interested. You never know. The only, the only time on a platform, Leanne, that somebody knows who you are is when, let's say we talked before about the offers and articles.
When you send those out, they come from you. And that's, that's the time that if someone's seeing, you know, you put out your, you know, your promo for website reviews or, you know, whatever. That's when you want somebody to know who you are. They can actually contact you directly through the system, or they can call you from the phone, you know, right there.
So the ability to do that. Again, but that's promoting your business. That's getting in touch with somebody that wants to hear from you. So all these little things that we're talking about just all made sense to us.
Leighann Lovely: Right. Very interesting. I love that. And I love that you have an avenue to share a variety of different information, but only to those who are interested in that information.
Right. Like, I, I'm not, I'm not going to be interested in. A variety of stuff like that, right? I don't and the [00:28:00] other thing I don't like to have to do is manage my unsubscribe list like I don't want to have to say I'm not interested in sending out my podcast or my newsletter to people who aren't interested in it because it's more time for me to manage the unsubscribe list.
I would rather have people who are interested in the content that I have or the product that I'm offering than people who are not interested. Like, it's just more work for me.
Scott LeBeau: Right. And the good thing is, is that literally when you go into the thing and create the submit form, once you hit submit, that's it.
You don't do anything else. It literally goes out to the people directly.
Leighann Lovely: The people who are interested, the people who have, who have stated that they would be interested in learning about my podcast or my business, you know, sales rescue of learning about, you know, how they can increase whatever it might be, very interesting.
I love it. I love it.
Scott LeBeau: So think, think too about all the [00:29:00] people that have a newsletter that literally sits on a website waiting for someone not to find it. I mean, I'm not trying to be true, but it's true because again, if, if in order for someone to find it, they have to search me. And if I'm on page 1 million of a search, that's never going to happen.
This is a way, this is a way for that accountant. And it would have been a great way for you too. You could have easily gone into your system. You could have typed in accountant and look, just look for articles. You could have gone in and seen anything somebody posts.
Leighann Lovely: I am now on your platform. So yes, thank you.
Live and learn. Next time I, next time I need to find, you know, something I, I will definitely be tweaking what I am interested in seeing. So, well, Scott, if you could give advice to somebody, let's say in your position, you know, is there anything that you would do differently when you first started out?
I've
Scott LeBeau: been asked this question before and, you know, my response has always been the same. No, because I [00:30:00] can't. Every decision I made at that point was based upon the knowledge I had at that time. And so much of what I've built over this time is a result of what I've learned through that process. So, for me, I go, Failure doesn't scare me, you know, um, and that's something that I think a lot of people are like, I'm done.
I'm giving up. But again, I think that is what's going to make you stronger. That's what's going to help you identify things, you know, that you can change going forward. You can't change the past, but I can change the future. I can shape the future.
Leighann Lovely: That is spoken like a true, true through and through entrepreneur.
Let me tell you, because, and it's funny, cause I just had an interview with, um, her name is Kathy. She's the owner of yellow leaf candle company. And she said the same thing that you said is that failure doesn't scare me. It's, you know, and I love, I love hearing that because I fail. I feel probably on a daily basis at something, [00:31:00] right?
Scott LeBeau: Well, yes, my kids, it's like hourly at least, so it's all good.
Leighann Lovely: Right. Yes. My daughter and she's, and we were carving pumpkins yesterday and even during that process, she you know, Mommy, why did you do that? I failed. Yeah. Here's the thing. And this goes back again to another, another interview that I had with Ben Zhang a long time ago.
If you are, if you have to fail and we do as entrepreneurs fail forward. Learn something from that experience that can help you into the future, which is exactly what you just said, is that failure is not our enemy. It is the gateway to us learning what to do next. And that, that's beautiful, because
Scott LeBeau: Yeah, it is.
And, you know, back in the day when I've gone through interviews, you know, people, Oh, what do you tell us? And I always hate those questions. But one of the things I've told him, I said, I probably have learned more of what not to be from managers I didn't like than what to be from people I did [00:32:00] like,
Leighann Lovely: because
Scott LeBeau: I know, I know how I felt when I was handled or taken, you know, addressed in a certain way.
And I think that even, even from some probably very negative situations. I don't hold grudges. I don't hold anything because I've learned and I, and I took the positive out of a negative.
Leighann Lovely: And that is exactly the way that I have lived my life. I am the queen of walking away, assessing the situation and forgiving.
Because Holding on to negative, you know, negativity, even when you feel that you were wronged. Forgiveness and moving on and realizing that you just need to learn from even if it's a horrific manager that made you feel like crap every single day. That's for them to learn. Right. And for me to, to realize that I don't want to be like that, especially as a manager and I will learn from it, move past it, forgive and move on.
Scott LeBeau: Right. And it's hard because you can't [00:33:00] take your value system and put it into somebody else that was raised a totally different way and has different set of values. And I think, um, That's so easy to do. And I think it's much harder to do, go the other way and actually think about it and say, okay, you know, what was their perspective?
And I think if you can understand that you, you evolve, right?
Leighann Lovely: So we are coming to time, Scott, I'm going to give you your 32nd shameless pitch.
Scott LeBeau: All right. Okay. We practice this and I always forget it. It's only 30 seconds, but the short of what we do is we connect buyers and sellers directly. effortlessly with one another.
 And again, any feedback, someone wants to call, I'm just an email or a phone call away so
Leighann Lovely: awesome. And we will put your email, and your website, in the show notes. So, um, anybody who wants to reach out to you, Scott, they will be able to do that. This conversation went so fast, but it was amazing.
And, I really appreciate you coming on.
Scott LeBeau: Well, thanks to me, it's just another one of our therapy [00:34:00] sessions that we have, which is, which is always, they're always fun. But again, this is, it's all about learning. It's all about how do you get work in conjunction with people that have the same goals of success that you do.
So thank you very much, Leanne, for letting me be here.
Leighann Lovely: Yes. And again, thank you for coming on.
Scott LeBeau: Okay.

Mastering Modern Sales Leadership: Strategies for Success in a Changing World

In this riveting episode of the Love Your Sales, host Leighann Lovely delves deep into the nuances of sales leadership with her guest, Dustin Kavelaris, Wisconsin Sales Director for Office H2O. They unpack the challenges of transitioning top-performing salespeople into effective leaders, highlighting the crucial distinction between bosses and true leaders. The conversation addresses the importance of authenticity, lifelong learning, and the pitfalls of micromanaging through metrics. Dustin shares invaluable insights on maintaining a thriving sales team by fostering a culture of two-way accountability and forward-thinking leadership. Tune in to discover how modern sales leadership can drive retention, performance, and overall success in any organization.
 
Contact Dustin
Website – www.officeh2o.com
LinkedIn - www.linkedin.com/in/dustinkavelaris
 
Special Thank you to our Sponsors – Genhead – www.genhead.com and Sales Rescue – www.rescuemysales.com
Robb Conlon – Intro and outro – Westport Studio - https://www.westportstudiosllc.com/
The Brave Ones – Instrumental Version Song by Jan Sanejko - https://artlist.io/royalty-free-music/song/the-brave-ones/119489
 
Leighann Lovely: Welcome to another episode of Love Your Sales. I am so thrilled that today I am joined by Dustin Cavallaris. Uh, Dustin is a Wisconsin sales director for Office H2O, A leader in modern purified drinking water and commercial ice equipment for businesses. He is an established sales and people leader for nearly 20 years.
He's led sales divisions in direct B2C, [00:02:00] B2B, indirect channel management, and has navigated a plethora of sales leader Ship roles for small privately held companies up through publicly traded fortune 50 companies. He's completed sales coursework through the Northwestern Kellogg Executive Education and is committed to lifelong learning.
I love that. Thank you so much, Dustin, for joining me today. I look forward to this conversation.
Dustin Kavelaris: Thank you so much for having me. I couldn't be more thrilled to talk about All the things that you cover here.
Leighann Lovely: Yes, I'm a complete nerd. I am a lifelong learner as well. I love the opportunity that I get to have people come on and educate me.
It's really, you know, uh, a roundabout way of, of getting people on the hot seat and being able to pick their brain. Right. So, so tell me, a little bit about your, uh, experience, your background and a high level of, you know, kind of Being that leader, that sales leader [00:03:00] that, you know, and what you do and kind of on a daily basis.
Dustin Kavelaris: Yeah. Yeah. Well, you know, I, I started, you know, I think from 16 years old had been in some sales centric capacity and, so through college, uh, was my first true kind of sales, you know, high activity sales gig. And I was, I started in telecom, ended up working my way up through from a standard sales consultant up through a regional sales manager.
And, you know, the epiphany I had, I don't know, it was probably 2007, you know, I had a really tough, I'm going to call him a boss to work for. And I, I distinguish boss and leader because I think there's such a interesting dynamic between those two phrases. Um, I don't, I don't let my teams today call me boss.
Cause you know, the behaviors between the two are just very different. But I just remember thinking to myself, man, you know, I, I love the impact that leaders have had a tough boss to work for, and just kind of vowed that, [00:04:00] you know, if I got into leadership, I wanted to be, you know, the leader that I didn't have at that time.
And so, yeah, I spent, uh, you know, a whole lot of years, 16 years in telecom kind of working my way up through the corporate life, so to speak, Big corporate merger happened and exited that during COVID, uh, went back to kind of a medium sized privately held company and then to an even smaller company.
And so I've been through the whole gamut of, you know, company sizes and dynamic of teams and different channels and all along the way, you know, just the experience in the different people you interact with, the different type of teams, the reoccurring theme never changes on what people look for in a, company.
In a leader and particularly call it modern day leadership, but just it has evolved and is evolving quickly. And just, there's a lot of companies that are stuck in a position that don't think they've got a good pulse on this. So I'm excited to talk more about kind of what that means from my vantage point.
Leighann Lovely: [00:05:00] Very interesting. So, and I love, I love when people have that multifaceted experience of working for. The large private, you know, the large companies, that are, the privately held, the publicly, I think that it gives that, and I've had that experience as well, where, you know, you're working for a privately held, decent sized organization.
And then you go into a monster size organization that's publicly traded, because there is a completely different, you know, feel. to it. Or there can be, there can be a completely different feel to it. Um, but I, I love those backgrounds when, when you, when you're able to talk to somebody and they go, Oh yeah, yeah.
So I've, I've been able to experience a variety of different environments and you can pick out the things that you directly like immediately. and see the trends of what doesn't work really [00:06:00] quickly.
Dustin Kavelaris: Absolutely. And, and the dynamics are very different, you know, I mean, night and day. And so I think there are folks who right, wrong and different.
They've either kind of stayed in one place or they've targeted similar sized companies. And you, when you, in my opinion, when you go to publicly traded companies, particularly big ones and very tall organizations, and there's Layers of red tape, and there's, you know, a ton of kind of call it company politics for lack of a better term to navigate those.
You know that the skill sets to work through that as a leader and have your team successful. It's very different than when, you know, you can just walk right up to a president, you know, at a small company and say, Something's not working here. Can we fix this? So yeah, very different. And, you know, but like I said earlier, the, the thing that never changes though, is what people need to be successful.
And, and yeah, it's experiences. , it's been very, uh, humbling, you know, to be able to talk, you know, talk about those different experiences.
Leighann Lovely: Right. [00:07:00] Yeah. Yeah. And I, I remember just even, and I want to get back to that, what people need In order to be successful, but for a second, I just want to reminisce here for, for two seconds.
You know, I remember my days of like, I want to go to this networking meeting and happening to get approval for like a 25 fee. Like, it's like, it's like, why do I have to fight so hard to get, you know, approval to go and do my job versus that small company where it's like, they just hand you a credit card and go, yeah.
Here you go, like go out and, meet people, have lunches, you know, and, and spend money. And you're like, Oh, okay, I can do that. And you're like, wait, but you're a small company. Like, do I have a budget? And they're like, just don't spend that much. Like if, if it gets up, talk to you and you're like, seriously, yeah, you have a monster company, like a monster size.
publicly million billion dollar company that's [00:08:00] like, you have to go through, jump through hoops to spend 25 at a networking event. And you're like, what is going on? Like, why is it so hard to do my job? Sorry. Okay. Anyways, I digress. So. Right. I'm just, I'm just thinking, and again, you know, I had that same, like, because I worked at a very large publicly traded company and while there were some perks that were amazing, um, like, because once you did get approval, you could get approvals for some larger budgeted items because they had, and the training, you know, there were some perks of like, they would send you for training and they had a budget of 5, 000 where, you know, You know, they would actually send you out of state for some really great, amazing training programs.
But it took six months to a year where they finally came back and they're like, yeah, we've got this much of a budget. It's like, okay, great. I asked for that a year ago, but you know, it's great that it's finally been approved. , you know, things just, okay, [00:09:00] so let's talk about the thing that's consistent among, you know, what people, what salespeople need.
To be successful, that's kind of that consistency throughout any organization.
Dustin Kavelaris: Yeah. Well, you know, I think regardless of your title and role, I know this is, it tends to be a sales centric conversation and, you know, leadership is its own form of sales because you're, you know, you're kind of selling to everyone around you about.
The value proposition you bring to the table, but let's start with, uh, kind of how we got here to begin with and some considerations of, you know, if you're in a position right now where you're asking yourself, like, do I have an effective sales organization? Is my entire company, you know, a well tuned machine, you know, the, the sales organization portion of that, I think, you know, I'm probably biased here, of course, being in, in sales and leadership, but you know, the [00:10:00] revenue engine for a company.
You know, every, every department is important, not discrediting that, but the revenue engine, you know, if, if that nozzle or, you know, or faucet gets turned off, it causes a really difficult domino effect. Uh, that's tough to navigate. And that downward spiral that happens when, you know, sales and revenue is down, it impacts everyone.
And so keeping this portion of the company in a healthy place. Yeah, I'd argue it's pretty important. So, you know, when you're looking at your sales organization leadership, , obviously, like, do you feel that you have modern leadership? And like, what's the litmus test on, you know, what that means? So you start with just, you know, what's the, You know, what's the growth trajectory and what's the attrition look like, you know, do you keep people then, you know, the old saying of, you know, people don't leave companies, they leave poor leaders.
 I, you know, there's definitely some truth to that.
Dustin Kavelaris: So the question is like, what do people need? Like if you're, if you're [00:11:00] new in sales, you're a tenured person in sales, like what do you need from leadership today? And the things that I think people don't get right. in leadership is, is people who understand what the current either new or older generation need and being a chameleon for different people.
And so the, some of the consistent things that I see that, you know, companies really need to take a hard look at is, do you have a leader who is a lifelong learner? And I, you know, I say that because lifelong learning to me or a lack there of is either a overconfidence that you got it all together. Or a just poor self awareness that you set the tone of making small increments of bettering yourself and your people around you every single day.
So, you know, when I've gone into organizations and I've looked at, you know, what's the environment like here, one of the first things I look for is the people around here, [00:12:00] are they pursuing growth mindsets and just getting better at things? Do you, to your earlier point about, you know, expenses being approved?
One point in time I had asked a district manager of mine, I'm like, you know, I've got this guy who wants to, you know, improve. He wants to move up the chain. He wants to become a better leader. There's a couple of books I'd like him to read. And it was like, this is an investment, right? In his professional development and getting a 20 book approved was like a huge hassle.
Yet companies spend an enormous amount of payroll, pulling people into meaningless meetings. You're quantifying the value of a meeting, but you pull a bunch of leaders into one and you got an absurd amount of payroll to talk about the business rather than doing the business. So, yeah, I mean, kind of the first thing for me is just what's the, what's the vibe on just general, are people working hard to get better at leadership or skill sets?
And [00:13:00] so if you don't have a dedicated budget, one of the, I was at a company called Penta Technologies and it was a construction, a small construction software company, and I'll tell you, kind of going the extreme end of this, um, my performance reviews there, part of my annual bonus was predicated on the.
Plan I put together on how I was going to just get better at being a leader. It was, what was I going to do to evolve? And so I had to build a plan and say, look, here are the things I want to do to get better as a leader contributor. It wasn't about sales results. It was about professional development and growth.
And that was like, you know, we're not going to pay you if you're not. Working hard to get better. And I'd love to be in a fly on the wall, you know, walk into some boardrooms or some, you know, senior leadership and say, look, can we carve out a budget or put a bonus tied to people just growing their capabilities as a contributor?
And I mean, you'd probably see a lot of eye rolls. Like we don't have a budget for that. It's [00:14:00] like, all right. So that's probably a long winded answer of, you know, are people getting better?
Leighann Lovely: It's the same concept of, you know, If it's not broken, don't fix it. Well, wait a second. Or the whole, well, we've been doing it this way forever and it, and it works.
Well, great. But everything around you is changing. You want to stay stagnant, but go peek outside because the world is not staying stagnant and you're going to be archaic. And everything around you is going to be all shiny and new and eventually people are just going to walk past you because you're not shifting and moving and growing with the times.
You're, you're going to be selling, you know, the way that people did 10 years ago, which is no longer going to be kosher with the way that people are buying. If that's how you want to do it, fine, like, but you're, you're going to be obsolete. That's what it [00:15:00] comes down to. If you want your team to never grow, expand, learn.
I mean, just, just think, just think from five years ago, the way that we, as Individuals now meet each other. Like I'm not, I, half the time I'm having a sales call. The first time I meet somebody is exactly how we're talking right now. That was not how I started, you know, five years ago. My first meeting was, okay, what's your address?
Where am I coming? Is there any special instructions on parking? Because I was meeting a lot of manufacturing companies at that time. A ton of them. And you did not meet. You know, and even today, if I'm talking to a manufacturing company, I still ask, do you want me to come in? Because there's still some manufacturing companies that are not up on, you know, a ton of zoom.
Majority of them have now shifted. And they're like, no, we can just meet via zoom. And I was like, oh, okay, wow. We're like the entire [00:16:00] world is now, you know, now zoom or teams or Google or pick your platform. Like it's shifted. And here's about the technology. I'm talking about these complete body language. I can no longer, this has been a learning curve.
I, as a sales person, I was taught when you walk in a room with somebody, read how they choose their chair, see how they sit, watch their body language. These are all different types of buying signs throughout a sales meeting. Well, you no longer have that luxury. You've got to learn a completely different way.
understanding buying signs now. So that's been a learning curve. Now I'm, I'm listening to, you know,. Now I'm listening to fluctuations in their voice, the tone, the [00:17:00] pauses. I mean, these are all things that as a salesperson, that if I'm meeting somebody via Zoom for the first time, it's completely different. I've had to learn a new skill set on, you know, are they putting their eyes up because they're interested, like, and, and a lot of people who are non salespeople don't understand Like, these are all things that throughout my career, I've, I've become hypersensitive to, like, and I'm sure you, you know, Dustin, you too, like, if somebody, you know, I, I remember back in the early days, if somebody would cross their arms and lean completely back in their chair, it was like, oh, crap, I really got to get this person back engaged.
Because these, you know, again, these are things that it's like, are they leaning in? Are they lean? But now it's a, it's a whole new world. It's a whole new world. Now again, if, if I get somebody in person [00:18:00] to have that first discovery, it's like, Oh God, okay, now I'm back in my comfort zone. Like this is the way that I grew up in sales.
Dustin Kavelaris: Yeah, you brought up some amazing points because, you know, just when you apply, you know, kind of all the technology, the different ways people purchase now, um, that the general capability of a salesperson has to, it's more robust. And you, you know, sales is a performance metric, you know, you, while you can kind of teach things, there are some Intangibles that top salespeople do that you, I don't think you can teach and, and navigating that today, you know, one of the, one of the other kind of elements that, you know, I think is both true for salespeople, but particularly in sales leadership too, is, you know, how do you bring authenticity to the mix?
And so we did this thing where everything was in person back in the day, back in the day, you know, what might mean to different people. You know, but I remember talking to my parents who was in sales and, you know, everything was they'd be on the road and like you [00:19:00] didn't, you didn't do stuff like this, you know, and so everything was a lot of human interaction.
And now there's a lot of different ways, you know, that opened up doors to be able to sell, you know, at a broader scale, but, you know, less direct human interaction. Some people aren't good with zoom. And so how do you bring authenticity? I think one of the other things that are prominent today that not enough people talk about is.
Dustin Kavelaris: If you want to lead a sales organization and it really kind of, I guess any organization for that matter is, you know, authenticity and leadership to me is the same as prospects are really good at knowing if you're, you know, kind of full of crap. You know, if there's that fake rapport. You know, and they can see right through it, you know, see, they see the motive behind, you know, what you're trying to accomplish.
And so there's a level of authenticity from prospect to salesperson, as there is sales leader to salesperson or team or insert leader, right. And kind of direct report. And so how do you, you know, I guess, how do you [00:20:00] navigate that? How do you teach authenticity and, you know, some things that people can do today to, Again, the litmus test is if I was a VP of sales, and I wanted to see if my director of sales was an effective leader, one of the first things I would do is I would, you know, I'd go out and survey my field team and say, you know, where's your confidence level and do either a skip lower review or something to see is.
Salespeople want to know that their boss can also do their job, that they're credible and that they'll roll their sleeves and get their arms dirty. Or when a salesperson brings an issue that their direct leader is going to go, go to battle for them and really have their back. And look, salespeople are inherently pretty good, you know, all things considering at kind of reading the room, at least, right.
That's part of being in sales is reading the room and body language and those. And if. They lose confidence that their direct leaders can [00:21:00] understand their true barriers to their success. And they're not just looking at some goofy dashboard that says all these metrics, which is a whole nother topic around, you know, kind of effective modern leadership is the metric topic, which, you know, we can certainly touch on, but yeah, the authenticity thing.
And can you do what your people do? Do you truly understand that? You know, if I want to dig into a failing sales organization, I would first go, you know, dig in, you know, what are, what's the field crew really struggling with and does their direct leader understand the dynamics and the difficulty? And are they blocking and tackling and helping pull revenue forward?
Not just saying, Oh man, let's work on some more activity and, you know, call it a, I'll call it a win. Try to, you know,
Leighann Lovely: you bring up an amazing point and here's, here's where there's, there's two things that I want to. So one, the quickest way to kill a salesperson, a high performing salesperson, is make them a manager.
However, that [00:22:00] being said, I don't want to work for a manager who hasn't walked in my shoes, who doesn't, who's never been a salesperson, because if they don't, if they've never experienced what it's like to Be out there and do the grind, make the calls, put the work in. They don't understand. What it's like to go through the pains of the pains of being a salesperson.
However, that being said, I go back to what I just said, the quickest way to kill a top producing salesperson is to say, Hey, you should be a manager.
Dustin Kavelaris: Amen. And yeah,
Leighann Lovely: right, right. So there's, there's that, you know, the chicken and the egg kind of situation of, well, oh crap. So you have, so an organization has to be wildly selective and careful and understand that.
Not every sales, not [00:23:00] every top producing salesperson, just because they're an amazing salesperson is meant to be a leader. And they may not even know that they're not meant to be a leader. And so many times I hear of like, Oh, I was promoted to a manager and it just didn't work out. And instead of that organization saying to that person, like, do you think that maybe.
It would be better for you to just kind of shift back into producing. Do you want to do that? And have that person be given the option of, you know what? Yeah, I, I was better at that than I am as a leader. They just, they'll just fire them and be like, yeah, this isn't working out. Sorry. You're not meeting.
And then they get fired and it's like, well, and sometimes that person got pushed into managing. In my career, I, I turned down multiple management roles. My, I was a top producer and they kept coming. We want you to be a manager. We want you [00:24:00] to, we want you to mentor everybody else. And I was like, no. I'm a producer and me alone and then they were like, okay, just mentor, just, you just, you know, just help the other team understand what your process is.
Like, I just want to produce. They see that that other person. Is like really doing a great job and they're like, how can we get this person to teach the other people what you're doing? And it's like, just you want to keep that really high producing person, like, still producing at a high level, leave them alone.
Dustin Kavelaris: I don't think you could have phrased that better.
Dustin Kavelaris: It is an absolute predicament. And that's why I think. really, really highly effective sales leaders. They're very difficult to find because it's a, it's a breed between being a high impact people leader and also being capable to understand the ins and outs of being an effective.
Salesperson and how to speak that language, high performing salespeople, they want the tools and they want a leader who will just get out of [00:25:00] their way and that when they come to the problem, they'll fight fiercely for them. And too often, yeah, the wrong people get promoted because they think that's the path.
And so how do you avoid that? Well, you know, it's gonna be like, well, geez, you know, if there can do good in sales, like, why can't they just help everyone do that? Well, it's like, well, If, if you use some of the tools that help assess people's personality styles and their dynamics, there's a couple of tools out there.
A lot of people do desk or predictive index and other things like that, but kind of tell you if you're one of those high performing sales people, but probably won't be great as a people leader. That's a good, good direct mechanism to try to figure that out. , we use predictive index at our, my current company and our, my last one too.
And there's some really great things that come from that. I'm getting kind of the right people on the right seat in the bus. Right. Uh, so yeah, I just couldn't agree more. And yeah, that's certainly why I think there are some sales organizations that they, they feel the momentum because the high performing sales guy was.
[00:26:00] driving revenue to a good place. And then what happens? We, we shifted him into a leadership role and, and then there's some stagnation or even decline. It's like, well, you know, the math is actually pretty easy. Right. So you know, you mentioned one other thing too, around what happens to a person that's wrongly promoted and it's, it's actually, you know, You said, you know, like, let's talk to them and say, look, we should maybe shift back into an individual contributor role.
That conversation to me is also where a lot of leadership fails. They can't exercise kind of radical candor. And there's a very fine line with being able to be very direct and candid with teams and knowing that, look, we're going to have a hard conversation. And it comes from a good place, but there's a delivery mechanism there.
And so, you know, effective communication and being a good leader, which comes from radical candor, being able to, I can forecast what my team needs, I'm out ahead of them and I can dissipate that. I can support them on the sales [00:27:00] side. I can navigate the leadership conversations. And it's a, it's a very tricky role to do it well, because.
Yeah, there's a lot of different skill sets needed. And when, you know, one of those portions fail, it just throws a wrench in your whole sales engine. You either knock it with a need or, you know, you lose people and then it starts the process over and depending upon your sales cycle, I mean, you lose a good person and a book of business, you know, goes stale.
Jeez. I mean, it could be quarters worth of revenue that it takes to recover from that.
Leighann Lovely: Right. It's, it's difficult when. People avoid hard conversations. But here's the thing. If you're planning on being a leader, you're planning, planning on running a business, you're, you're planning on managing people.
It's part of the job. It's your, you have to get comfortable with the uncomfortable. That's part of the job. There are going to be days that you have really hard, bad, [00:28:00] Shitty conversations and people are going to walk away all feeling bad about it. And here's something that's really important. If you are a leader and you enjoy those conversations, there's a problem.
If you are a leader and you enjoy firing people, that's a problem. It shouldn't be something that you enjoy doing. It's, it's a necessary evil, but if you start to enjoy it, that's a problem. And, and I say that, I say that because
people. Yes, sometimes deserve to be fired, but you are you are causing trauma to a human being and if You start to enjoy that then, then, yeah, there's, there's an issue with that, but sometimes it needs to be done.
Dustin Kavelaris: Yeah. Yeah. And I think, you know, for those who maybe aren't, you said, geez, am I good at, you know, being candid with people, you know, I, you need to go seek feedback and that's where, you know, kind of the lifelong learning, you know, feedback is a [00:29:00] gift.
 Something else I like around feedback is actually, you know, salespeople don't like to look back a long ways and get a bunch of, Feedback about kind of six months ago in a sales world feels like an absolute eternity. So if you have bi annual reviews or you've got a, you know, individual, you know, Improvement plan or performance plan, or, you know, some type of touch point to improve your circumstances, you know, a leader's got to look at, you know, the lens of, all right, if I'm a top performing salespeople, or I'm going to treat them like the capabilities they have, you can't go back to these ancient conversations, you need to be looking forward around, I'm going to give some evidence around what I observe, let's have some two way feedback, be able to apply that to how do you navigate the next steps here, I always tell people, you know, to me,
Dustin Kavelaris: The best leaders, what they do is they take complex problems and break them down into bite size, simple actions.
And some people just don't have the brain or the natural thought process. I'm like, how do I take [00:30:00] all this messy stuff? What feels like a insurmountable amount of work or difficulty or, you know, a tough sales cycle or these big personalities to deal with. And like, how do you break that down and navigate that?
And. Those are the things that actually move deals forward. Those are the things that keep people in your organization. And if they lose confidence that you can't help them with that in times they need it, then they're going to look around for, you know, people take the path of least resistance. So yeah, I mean, some excellent, you know, considerations there on, you know, what people need.
Leighann Lovely: So as we wrap up our conversation, what, what is the, what is the greatest advice that you would give? To, you know, a new leader coming up, you know, or somebody who's looking to become a leader in sales. What advice would you give to them?
Dustin Kavelaris: Man, I think, a lot of things, uh, I'd like to share cause it is a tough role, [00:31:00] but you know, one of the things that I was.
I always would tell as I was coaching new leaders in the organizations I worked at or someone who said, I want to move into leadership or I want to get better at this is, you know, you, you've got to be able to sit down and look things very empirically, you know, there's emotion and tied to things you, you deal with a lot.
Dustin Kavelaris: Leading people is inherently hard. It's, you know, some people do it more naturally, right. Cause they're just kind of bred for that. And, or they're just committed to it. But, you know, one of the things I would say is, you know, the best thing you can do is is instill two way accountability. This is that I'm gonna go back to that boss leader thing.
Bosses. It's very one way accountability. I'm going to look at results and address accordingly. It's not a reflection of did I give you the tools? Am I the one creating a bottleneck in my team's success? And so being empirical about like what you bring to [00:32:00] the table, where you add value. And the only way to do that is to go solicit candid feedback in two way accountability.
And it had that extremely comfortable. I, when I meet a new, like I've taken over a lot of sales teams. And one of the first things I tell people is look, one of the things I need from you is. To know anything I communicate to you comes from a good place. I'm invested in your success. But if there's ever a point where you feel I'm not bringing to you the value you need, I need you to walk in my office.
And I don't care what language you use. I don't care how you say it. But just walk in my office and tell me specifically where I dropped the ball. I won't be upset. I won't be, you know, emotional about it, just bring the evidence, you know, so we can speak in facts and there's some opinion there, but it eases the tension and the relationship tends to get off on a really good [00:33:00] start when people know that there's two way accountability and that there's a manager or a leader in the organization that says, I'm humble enough.
I can swallow my pride and ego. My title is not what's important. It's about the greater success. You got to embrace that general mentality. And if not, you're going to fail. People are going to leave. They're not going to work for crappy people anymore. This is not happening too many options. I can work remote.
I can go somewhere else. Job hopping is a thing I can go negotiate for money, you know, like all these reasons people have to leave and you need to be the reason that they want to stay. So, like, if you're not looking inward, you're going to have real problems looking outward, you know,
Leighann Lovely: the greatest leader leads as a servant, as a servant's heart and, and they are looking at.
Lifting their people up, not being the, the overlord of numbers and matrix. And, um, they are literally there to serve their team as a conduit to [00:34:00] get them everything they need to be successful. And if they're dropping the ball in any way, they need to be able to look at themselves and say, okay, maybe I'm not doing the best that I can do today and be willing to self improve.
 I grew up with a dad who is, you know, sales leader of, of sometimes a team of up to 65 people at any given time. That is a lot of salespeople, a lot of different personalities. Um, and I, you know, he, was on the phone at any, he, led a real estate team. So they were working all, all the time, right?
You know, real estate, any given time, most of the calls that I would hear when I was a kid, he wasn't talking about. It was usually more personal, like, I'm sorry to hear that that's going on. You know, how can I help you? And it's like, he literally was there kind of like a dad to all of his, to all of his team, just to help.[00:35:00]
that person through whatever they needed, when they needed it to help them. And it's funny when he retired, it was during the COVID, you know, during COVID he said, you know, let's not do a party. That's that would be too much of a mess to try to organize and blah. He asked for everybody to send him a card.
And I read some of these and it was insane how most of the people he led thought of him as a friend as a, almost a father figure of most of them saying, thank you for helping me create a career. And that is where I learned most of understanding of what a leader was supposed to be. They're not supposed to be somebody who is stopping you or making it more difficult for you to do your job, or somebody who sits down with you once a quarter [00:36:00] and says, now I've reviewed your matrix.
You are, are, are a hundred calls short of where you're supposed to be on your cold calls. Like that, like, oh my gosh. If that's how you're managing your team, you're not going to have one. And I, I remember interviewing for a job and they're like, we just want to set the expectations. We require 500 cold calls a week.
We require X amount of appointments a week. And we require, and I went, , yeah, I'm not interested. Like if this is a matrix driven job, I'm not interested. I am way beyond that as a salesperson. I, my relationships that I have and that I can bring to the table are worth way more than you telling me that I need to make 500, 500 cold calls a week.
And like, like, who, who,
Dustin Kavelaris: I'm chuckling because the, you know, it's, it's literally, [00:37:00] there's a, there's a great guy that I follow since Brian Burns, um, he talks about the brutal truth around sales and leadership. It's got, you know, he makes fun of this exact topic, , just the number of people in these leadership roles that they managed to dashboards and activity rather than capability and you know, who's actually producing and the amount of unnecessary work.
Poor leaders make good salespeople do administratively or just, uh, you know, kind of CYA so that when they go to present to their, you know, their leadership, you know, here's, here's the shiny presentation and let me show you everything we're doing rather than working on things that actually produce revenue and giving people autonomy to leverage their organic and excellent skill sets and personalities and networks.
Yeah, it's, I just. The spiral effect of managing to activity, it just top sales people will not put up with it.
Leighann Lovely: No, I mean,
Dustin Kavelaris: it's, it's pretty wild how many companies [00:38:00] still think that they can manage that way. It's, it's insane.
Leighann Lovely: No, I w I wouldn't even, I mean, even back, this was years ago, even back then I was like, that's, that's not how I sell.
Like, yes, I will do the activity, but I'm not going to sell that way. Like that's not how I, if you, if you're going to manage me that way, like, no, thanks, but anyways, we are coming to time. And right now, this is Dustin, the opportunity for you to give your 30 seconds, shameless pitch, go at it. Anything. I mean, you can, anything you want, 30 seconds, shameless pitch.
Dustin Kavelaris: Yeah, I'll, I'll take a plug. Yeah. So, you know, look, I'm a big, uh, you know, relationship guy. And so, you know, if you're in the greater Milwaukee market, , you know, our company office H2O, we're, we're the quintessential kind of two guys in a garage story. And now the largest privately held, uh, company, we do purified drink and water and ice systems for businesses.
And, and look, if, if you're open to connecting, I'm a big fan of kind of learning how the world goes around. Yeah. [00:39:00] And my favorite part is learning about, you know, other companies and, and the people. And so, um, I'd love to connect, you know, you certainly find me on LinkedIn, , or you can find me on officeh2o.
com and tell you more about how we, uh, call it the low hanging fruit to health, wellness, sustainability in your organization. Awesome.
Leighann Lovely: Yeah. And Dustin's LinkedIn and, his, where you can connect with him will be in the show notes. So yeah, reach out to him, but, um, again, Dustin, this has been an amazing conversation.
I really appreciate you joining me today.
Dustin Kavelaris: No, thank you for, hosting such a great podcast.
 

Overcoming Fear: Standing Out in a Crowded Market

Cathy Blachowski shares her journey into the competitive world of candle making, highlighting her fear of blending in with numerous vendors on platforms like Etsy. She emphasizes the importance of differentiation and staying true to her unique product, targeting individuals who truly appreciate her craftsmanship. Cathy’s courage to face failure head-on is central to her approach, enabling her to take bold steps in her business without the fear of setbacks. Her story is an inspiring testament to the resilience needed to carve out a niche in a crowded market. Join us to hear more about her path to creating a standout candle business.
 
Contact Cathy
LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/catherine-blachowski-39736355/
Website - www.yellowleafcandlecompany.com
Email - cathy.blachowski@gmail.com
 
Special Thank you to our Sponsors – Genhead – www.genhead.com and Sales Rescue – www.rescuemysales.com
Robb Conlon – Intro and outro – Westport Studio - https://www.westportstudiosllc.com/
The Brave Ones – Instrumental Version Song by Jan Sanejko - https://artlist.io/royalty-free-music/song/the-brave-ones/119489
 
Leighann Lovely: Welcome to another episode of love your sales. I am so thrilled today. I am joined by Cathy Blachowski.
She is an entrepreneur and owner of Yellow Leaf Candle Company, an e commerce store. And I would love, you know, Kathy, for you to tell us a little bit more about, , you know, what Yellow Leaf Candle Company is and does.
Cathy Blachowski: Yeah, so basically I created this company last year, um, based on my own health history.
So for years I've been suffering [00:02:00] from, chronic migraines, uh, severe sinus pressure, allergies, asthma, and was no longer able to breathe. Burn store-bought candles in my house. So I started making them myself for about five years and then realized that there are a lot of people out there that have the same sensitivities and struggles I do.
So I decided to bring them to the world in 2023, and now I am out there on the website, um, and I'm going out to fairs and craft. Any kind of expo I can get my hands on to share, , these clean burning eco friendly candles that don't irritate all the things, , that I've got going on with myself.
Leighann Lovely: Wow. So explain how that, how, cause I suffer from horrible allergies year round.
So explain to me how these candles work. don't affect, [00:03:00] you know, us who have the hose, those irritants, especially in the house. And, you know, we all bring these things into the home. We're like, Oh, it's, it smells great. It, it's awesome. But yeah, that's a real thing.
Cathy Blachowski: Yeah. So I realized that there's a bunch of candles that big box stores sell and they use the cheapest kind of wax that they can find.
So they can mass produce it. And the wax burns very fast. And the scent goes almost away immediately. And not only are you not getting the full effect of that candle, but you're not getting the full effect of how it burns to like the wicks that they use are cheap wicks. Um, I've noticed when you move furniture around, after you've lit a candle for years, that there's soot on your walls, there's soot on your ceilings and just think about what you're breathing in.
Like that. What's on your walls is in your lungs, and no wonder I was having asthma attacks every [00:04:00] single time. Um, it's, it's one of those things where you just don't realize what's the cause until you stop doing it. And then you're like, wow, like there is a better way that you can do this. So I did a ton of research on what is the cleanest, most combination of a burning candle that you can get.
So I found the soy wax. I found, you know, self trimming cotton wicks that don't create that mushroom, that the black that builds up inside the candles and goes everywhere. I mean, it was just disgusting to blow my nose after having a. A candle lit for three hours, like nobody should have to see soot coming out of your nose.
It, it terrified me, but it also woke me up to say, now there's something that I can do about it.
Leighann Lovely: Wow. , you've just blown my mind because I've never, you know, And again, yeah, I, when I go and sit out at a, you know, a fire pit outside, you go inside and you blow your nose and you're like, [00:05:00] Oh, that's disgusting.
But you would, you expect that when you're sitting by an open burning fire and you're throwing God knows what kind of wood on it. But you're right in your home. You want, everybody wants to be able to occasion, especially around the holidays. And, you know, you have your holiday sense, you have your Christmas, your Thanksgiving, whatever sense you want to be able to enjoy that.
But you, so, okay. So this came out of a personal journey.
Cathy Blachowski: Yep. So very long one. Let me tell you, I did a lot of testing with a lot of different things and I noticed, you know, that dyes can, you know, sometimes hinder the way that that burns too. So my candles have no dyes in it. There are no carcinogens in it.
I only use essential oils or certified clean, um, fragrance oils. So it's one of those things that you really have to do a lot of research with. [00:06:00] Otherwise, you know, you could go through it like me who did a lot of testing and, um, realize that there are so many ways to do it wrong. But when you finally find that money combination, it's like finally I found it.
I feel really good about this. I mean, I was giving hundreds of candles away to people and say like, Hey, burn this. Let me know what you think. And it was a lot of people who suffer from the same things I do, especially migraines and stress headaches and everything like that, because those scents can be so overpowering.
And I didn't, I didn't want to put that on somebody's plate either. So, lot of testing, lot of trial and error.
Leighann Lovely: And that's what that's what it's about to write getting the proper product in front of people that not only has come from a passion project of your own of being able to still enjoy burning a candle.
Cathy Blachowski: Yeah. Things that you don't realize you've missed it until you've missed it, you know, like [00:07:00] I, it was, there were so many years that have gone by that I'm like, man, I really wish I just had something crackling right now, you know, not all of us have fireplaces and not all of us have fire pits in our backyard.
So we don't get that opportunity to be able to have that experience somewhere else. So it was nice for me to find that and bring that back into the house, even with cats. And even with a young child, you know, years ago, now my daughter's 21, it's not really an issue. She's not knocking over stuff, but you know, two cats run around the house, you know, dogs wag their tails, things fly, like it happens.
So you got to make sure that you have something that's still safe, um, that if something were to happen and something got knocked over, it blows out immediately. It's not going to set your house on fire.
Leighann Lovely: Wow. Yeah. Amazing. So let's talk about the sense. Where, where do you come up with the, all of the different eco friendly or the essential oils and all of these different scents that are, I mean, do you create them on your [00:08:00] own?
Do you, do you find people who create the scents?
Cathy Blachowski: Yeah, it's kind of a combination of both. , I find what I'm, what I do is I do a lot of research into what other people are selling. So I know kind of what's out there and what other people are looking for. Um, so I would say probably maybe 40 to 45 percent of my assortment are those, you know, typical vanilla, lavender, eucalyptus, you know, I'm looking for those, Looking for those that people are going to want to buy no matter where you go.
But then I'm also looking for the one offs, the ones that you're like, really, did she just do that? Uh, yeah, I did. , I do love creating really weird combinations of things. One of them that was a happy mistake was a bourbon vanilla. I know it, it was a really happy mistake. I was doing a bourbon coffee and I was doing a vanilla at the same time.
And I Poured the bourbon in the wrong pot. And I was like, Oh, and then I was, well, wait, that's [00:09:00] actually not that bad. So I ended up keeping it. And it's actually one of my best sellers right now.
Leighann Lovely: Really a happy mistakes become, become one of the best sellers. Well, who doesn't love bourbon? Who doesn't love bourbon?
I
Cathy Blachowski: know the smell is so sweet. And with the coffee, you know, it, it enhances the coffee in the bitter and the, the, um, kind of like thicker way, but in the vanilla, it makes it a little sweeter. it changes it just a little bit. So it's funny how you can use bourbon in a couple of different ways. I'm probably not going to use it in any other way, because I think I found the two that work really, really well.
 But I do get a lot of suggestions from people too. So, um, I've worked with a couple of people who are like, Hey, I really like this, is this something you can do? Or I smelled this somewhere. I'm just wondering if you could do that. And I love getting those requests because it just helps me become a better candle maker, but it allows me to have the size assortment that I [00:10:00] have.
So it's kind of getting out of hand right now. Um, I do have quite a few out there, but I love being the person who you can go to and say, can you make this? And I can be like, I will find a way.
Leighann Lovely: So speaking of that, can you make this? So, you know, you take suggestions from people. You're if it sounds like you're an evolving entrepreneur who's open to new ideas.
So let's, let's talk a little bit. How did you start on the sales side as a brand new, I'm making candles. I want to put myself out there. Where did you start?
Cathy Blachowski: Probably in the wrong places, to be honest. never really thought that. This was going to go as far as it has so far, and I've so much further to go, but basically I was just kind of like talking to people and say, Hey, what are you guys doing?
Or have you gone to a craft show lately? Or do you know of anybody who is putting on a show that needs somebody that has candles? And I just kind of was doing a lot of [00:11:00] asking around. I didn't really know where to begin. So I was doing a lot of online searches for craft fairs and, um, Started actually with Coffeeville in Jackson last November was my first official fair that I did.
 And it was so nice to just be able to set up a booth and be like, okay, we're just going to wing it. I don't know what I'm doing, but I'm going to fake it till I make it. And it's going to be amazing. And I have evolved since. So like my first booths were very minimalist. And now again, I've You know, explored other options of different way of designing my booths.
So they, you know, as the product expands, you know, my booth expands with it. So it was a lot of just talking to a lot of different people. And fortunately I'm in a lot of networking groups that let, it really allows me to reach a lot of people to ask these questions. And I've been very glad and lucky to have a bunch of mentors be able to help me on this journey as well.
Leighann Lovely: That's amazing. And so, and it sounds like [00:12:00] you've, you've leaned in to the expertise of those who have, you know, so not to reinvent the entire wheel, but to, you know, go to those who kind of know, have been there to ask for that. That's, that's, that's amazing. One of the key things to, you know, to understanding how to grow, where to go, how to start, what to do, navigating that, that unknown world of entrepreneurship and sales and getting your product out there.
So do you do special orders, like say a Christmas order or a company wants to use your product to gift all of their employees, or do you do that type of thing?
Cathy Blachowski: I sure do. I've actually gotten a lot of requests from realtors, um, for their closing gifts for, you know, when they sell a house, I've worked with mortgage lenders for the same reason, once their loan is secure, you know, there's gifts with that [00:13:00] I've done some bridal parties.
 So if the, you know, whoever's showing like having a bridal shower or something, that they can give out those types of gifts too, um, and all customizable. So it's not like you just have to have one of every, you know, one specific scent for everybody. It's like, why don't you tell me what you're looking for?
Or if you don't know what you're looking for, let me suggest a few things that are best sellers that a lot of people seem to like, and then throw in one, you know, maybe that might be a little off the wall, but you know, it might hit the right person. I do a lot of, , like little donations at some of the fairs that I do too.
I was just recently, it was at an event at the Waukesha County Expo Center and I gave out 50 little tins to the first 50 people who came to the event and seeing these ladies walking around with these bags and I'm like, Oh, what did you get? And, you know, somebody pulled it out. They're like, I got fresh cut grass.
And she's like, it's one of my favorite scents. That's not everybody's favorite scent, but I'm glad I [00:14:00] hit the right person. So it's, it's just really nice to see, you know, even how much it's already grown in the year that it's already been out, but I have so much more to do still. And I love doing customizable orders.
I'm going to actually be putting together gift baskets for Christmas that will be available at the store. I met in Hartford. I'm not sure yet if I'm going to put them online, um, just because those are a little bit harder, but if people want to order them, I can definitely customize an order for that.
Leighann Lovely: Very interesting. So, I'm sorry. I heard fresh cut grass. Yes. So where, where does somebody put that in their house? Like, is that a bathroom scent? Is that a man cave or a woman cave scent? Like where, where do we have fresh cut grass? And mind you, I'm allergic to grass. Me too. It doesn't mean I don't like the smell of it, but usually when somebody is cutting their grass.[00:15:00]
I'm running into my house closing all my windows because I know I'm about to sneeze like 20 times in a row.
Cathy Blachowski: Yep. Yep. Um, it's funny that, you know, the real thing will give you that reaction. So you do have to be very careful when you're making these that that doesn't happen to when people are. Burning them in the house.
But yeah, I love, I actually use it sometimes in my living room because when you come through our front door, you enter right into the living room. So it's almost like an extension of being outside, but it's fresh enough that you could pretty much put it anywhere. , I've never known anybody to put it in a bathroom, but yeah, Jeff or no.
Leighann Lovely: I just, I, you know, I just kind of threw that out there. Like, where does that, like, you don't set it outside because you've already got the smell outside, but where in the house does that fit? And again, to each their own. I don't know that I would burn that scent, um, again, because it would probably be on edge all the time going, wait.
Why am I not sneezing? What is [00:16:00] another off the wall? So you said bourbon, you know, the bourbon vanilla. Is there another one?
Cathy Blachowski: Another surprising one that I've done that a lot of people are like, Ooh, I would have never thought of that was an apricot chamomile. Chamomile can get really overpowering.
And I tried to cut it with something that was a little more citrus so it wouldn't be like in your face chamomile. Um, so that was another surprising concoction that I did, but I know how many people love lavender. So I actually combined lemon and lavender together too, and found out that there is a person that I know that does not like lavender at all.
She ended up leaving my booth with a lemon and lavender candle. She was just like, I don't know what you did with the lemon, but it changed the way that the lavender was. And now the lavender doesn't bother me as much. She's like, it's absolutely amazing. So I.
Leighann Lovely: Interesting.
Cathy Blachowski: Yeah, I just, I do a lot of really different, [00:17:00] really different kind of combinations.
But, you know, I've, I've had some winners and I've had some doozies, the doozies I burn in my own house, so nobody has to deal with those . But, um, a lot of happy accidents, in this house. So that's kind of awesome.
Leighann Lovely: The, I, you know, lemon, the, I guess. I don't know that I've ever found a lemon candle and I love the smell of lemon.
Anytime I, I'm sure everybody else does this, but anytime you're using a lemon for anything, you throw it down your garbage disposal and then it like kind of percolates through your kitchen for a long period of time. But I can imagine burning a lemon and lavender or just a lemon. I don't know this Would lemon be overwhelming just alone?
Cathy Blachowski: It can be. I actually made a lemon cello candle way back in the day and it was so underwhelming that I was like, I can't put out there. I just don't, I don't feel like I did it right. So when I was experimenting with the [00:18:00] lemon again, I was like, okay, let's just see how this one ends up. And it ended up working out just fine.
So I think if you get the right combination, um, Kind of let go of the bad things that have happened in the past with it. It, it ended up turning out pretty amazing. So very happy with that one.
Leighann Lovely: You know, I would be wildly, you know, I think that a lot of men and women have different and not for everybody, but I know that my husband and I have very different ideas of what.
A room should smell like, you know, I'm, I'm going to guess that he'd be like bourbon. Ooh, yeah. Bourbon. And, and I'm like, Ooh, lavender bourbon and lavender. I bet you we would agree on that one quite well. Cause it has that sweetness. It has that. I'm going to guess that you probably make some concoctions that my husband and I would actually agree on.
Cause I'll come home with like a blueberry scent and he's like, or a blueberry apple pie or something, or a blueberry pie. And he's like, [00:19:00] Is way too sweet. And every time I walk in the room, I want to eat.
He wants to smell pine needles year round. And I'm like, not year round Christmas only. And he, yeah, no, he year round, he's like, no, I just love the sun. This is the only, and I'm like, ah, but I'm going to guess that, you know, you probably are able to come up with some, some pretty awesome smells that would appease us both.
Cathy Blachowski: Yeah, actually, there's a couple of different sense that I've noticed that a lot of, um, I made it with a man's intention, but my daughter seems to absolutely love them. So it's, it's one of those things where, I think it could go either way, depending on exactly what you're looking for. So like I, mahogany teakwood is one of another, one of my best sellers,
It is a little bit as sweet, but it's very woody [00:20:00] too, but it's not like pine needle woody.
It's more like, it just smells like wood and spice. And that is something that. I've noticed whether you're a man or a woman, it doesn't really matter. They, everybody seems to love it. And it's one of the ones that you can find pretty much almost anywhere. So yeah, it's, I've also.
done a couple other ones that are a little bit more earthy, a little bit more grounded. So that men can be like, Oh yeah, this is totally, I can put this in my man cave. Right.
Leighann Lovely: Well, and when you say that, I think, Oh my God, cedar. Like I, I have a cedar chest, um, a very large cedar chest. And every time I open it, I'm like, I can just stick my head in here and just breathe in the smell of cedar.
Like, I love it.
Cathy Blachowski: One of my favorite woods to smell. Yep.
Leighann Lovely: Yeah, it's just, oh, that, that smell, mm, I don't know where I would put it.
Cathy Blachowski: In your bedroom.
Leighann Lovely: In my bedroom. Yeah. I mean, I, I really, honestly, I would put that, I could put that smell anywhere. I don't know how much [00:21:00] my, my daughter would love it. She's six.
She'd probably be like, mom, what is that? You know,
Cathy Blachowski: learn to love it too. You never know. Right.
Leighann Lovely: Right. Right now she's obsessed with spraying her hair with a smell of cupcake. I'm like,
Cathy Blachowski: uh. Oh. And she would probably love most of the things that I have that are sweet. Like I do a birthday cake and a carrot cake and a blueberry muffin and a apple pie, a cider doughnut, like all of those food ones she would probably really thoroughly enjoy.
I also have a buttermilk pancakes one that seems to be a real kick with the kids. So.
Leighann Lovely: That that's see, that's the perfect one for like a Sunday morning, lazy day where you just want to curl on, like in winter where you want to curl up and just have that sweet like morning under a heap of blankets and snowing outside.
And you're like, yeah, I just love the smell of morning breakfast and coffee and pancakes. Yeah.
Cathy Blachowski: Yup. [00:22:00] Yup. No calories with these. So it's even more.
Even better. Yeah. Smell it, but have no calories. No, there's no, there's no regret after burning this candle. There's no.
Leighann Lovely: So I'm going to, I'm going to hit you with a couple of harder questions here. If you could give advice to, you a year ago when you were first starting out, what do you think that would be, uh, or what advice would you give yourself when it comes to, you know, starting this all out?
Cathy Blachowski: I think the biggest thing was I was really
Cathy Blachowski: I was really afraid that I was the only one out there that was dealing with the issues that I have and that people wouldn't accept what I was doing. There are a ton of candle makers out there and to be able to differentiate yourself, like I was getting into a [00:23:00] business that.
There's a lot out there. Etsy, I think has at least over 50 vendors and I'm like, I'm not going to compete with them. Like, that's just, that's not, those aren't my people. Like, my people are the ones who, you know, come see me and know me and know that I am truly putting out something that is spectacular and something that they can stand behind.
 I just, I'm not afraid to fail, which is one of the things that mostly everybody says I've failed so many times in my life that that's one of the things that doesn't that I have no fear of that. I just jump right in and if it doesn't work it doesn't work it's not a big deal but I was really, I was really more worried that I wasn't going to be able to find the right people who are looking for this type of item that doesn't want, you know, you know, I mean, you're not going to pay much more for what I've got.
Cathy Blachowski: Actually, you're going to pay less and it's going to last a lot longer. But then how do you like grab those people to try and keep them and not go to those big box stores, even [00:24:00] though they're on sale for 80 percent off and you're still spending a lot of money on it and getting not the best quality. So I was just more worried about not finding, finding the right crowd.
Leighann Lovely: And so what advice would you, would you say to that person?
Cathy Blachowski: I think I would just tell myself, don't worry about that. You know, the people are going to come to you and the more you get out there and the more you get to talk to people, the more they're going to see the value in what you have. And once they take one home with them, they're going to absolutely love it.
And I don't really have to worry about not being able to find that person anymore.
Leighann Lovely: That's, that's amazing advice and, and advice that others need to listen to, because I think that when we sweat the small stuff, when we're starting out, it can become debilitating if we don't find a mentor or somebody to say, Hey, there's others who understand exactly [00:25:00] what you're feeling may not be, you know, in the same way, because I'm not making a candle, but You know, I'm still, I'm still.
Putting myself out there with something, but that's, that is really, you know, Kathy, really good advice. And I, and I love that. And we, I fail every day a little bit here, a little bit there, but it's not about the failures. It's about the way that we overcome them.
Cathy Blachowski: Absolutely. Absolutely. And the more you fail, the more opportunity you get to make yourself a better, not a better person necessarily, but just know.
You just have a little bit different perspective on things. It's not like you're, it's, you're not sweating the small stuff anymore. It's more like, okay, what's the next big thing that I'm going to have to deal with? Let's go. Let's take it on. I'm ready.
Leighann Lovely: And I don't really consider things failures if you're learning from [00:26:00] it so that you're not repeating.
Cathy Blachowski: Right.
Leighann Lovely: I mean,
Cathy Blachowski: sanity comes with repetitions. If you stop repeating the same thing, eventually you're going to get a different result. And that's just what it is. It's a whole different mindset. You just have to teach yourself that there is a different way of doing things, that there is a different way to look at things.
And there are so many things out there that you could be stressing about. Don't, don't stress those, you know, like just get through it, move on, move forward, move forward. And everything is going to be gravy after that.
Leighann Lovely: And so if you had advice to give to a younger Not even a younger. Let's, let's say somebody who's like, Hey, I've got this cool idea.
 I want to go out because we are in, in the right now, the world of startups and the world of people wanting to go out on their own and try new things. What advice would you give to that, that young, that old, that [00:27:00] any entrepreneur, I keep saying young because I think, Oh yeah, the young, but there are, there are people older than me who are like, yeah, I'm going to start my own thing.
I'm going to do my own thing. And, and I will put the caveat that it is not for the faint of heart. I mean, if I if I had to give advice, there's a book we could we could all sit down and write a book together of the things that you do not know that you are going to eventually know. What advice would you give to that that person who's Got that huge light bulb following them around, thinking about going out on their own.
Cathy Blachowski: Yeah. The first thing I would say is don't, don't tiptoe around it. If there's something that you really want to do, go do it because now is the time. If you're thinking about it now, do it now. And there are so many other ways that, you know, you can reach out to people in order to help. So the second thing I would be, it would be like, first, do it now.
Go out and do it. And secondly, how can I help you? I am that type of person who wants to be involved in [00:28:00] as much as I can. I've done a ton of volunteer work. I was a former Girl Scout leader, former volleyball coach. I just absolutely love being able to help people. And if somebody wants to start something and they have that drive and they have that, that will to succeed.
All I want to do is be a part of it somehow if it's mentorship, if it's just being there to ask questions if it's literally to help set up something. It's, it's something that I want to be a part of and I think that goes a really long way when you can have somebody who's behind you, no matter what you're doing, even if I don't know anything about it, because I do that all the time too.
Um, it's, it's one of those things that you just have to just, you just got to take it and you got to go with it. There's, there's no turning back.
Leighann Lovely: Awesome. Now, if somebody wants to check out your product, I'm going to give you your 30 second shameless pitch. So if somebody wants to find your products, I want to know where, you know, are you running any specials that are coming up?
Are [00:29:00] you, you know, what is, what is your 30 second shameless pitch? Give me that. And, um, we'll kind of wrap up here.
Cathy Blachowski: Yeah, so, you can find me at yellowleafcandlecompany. com. I'm actually going through a website redesign right now too, so it may look a little different if you've been there already.
 I have an events tab on that page as well that shows you everywhere that I am going to be found in the state of Wisconsin. Um, so this upcoming weekend I'll be in Okachi, the following weekend I'm in Franklin, Then in November, I'm going to be heading out to Rio and Juno, and then I'm going to be in Jackson again.
So I'm kind of all over the place. Uh, Beaver Dam, I'm going to be hitting up once, probably another one in Sheboygan. So if you can't find me, you're not looking real hard, but yeah, you can find everything is already, like I said, on my website, you can pretty much reach out to me at any time. I'm on social media as well.
I have, you know, a Facebook page. I use LinkedIn. So. Just if you're, looking for [00:30:00] something, just, just let me know and I'll get it to you.
Leighann Lovely: Yeah. And in the show notes, you will be able to find, Kathy's website. You'll be able to find her LinkedIn. So, go check it out. she has amazing products and Kathy, this has been such an amazing conversation.
I really appreciate you opening up to us and telling us a little bit about your background and your entrepreneurial journey.
Cathy Blachowski: Yeah, it's thank you for having me. It's something that again, I would have been fearful of, three weeks ago. But when, when you sit down and think about it, it's not so bad when you're talking about something that you believe in, it makes it a very easy conversation to have.
And I just want to know, I want to let everybody know out there that there is something out there that you can do, you know, that would be better for you. There are healthier options out there for you and they are not necessarily more expensive than what you're doing. So just keep that in mind, wherever you go, there are always other options.
 
Leighann Lovely: That. And yeah, make sure that you check out the website.
Cathy Blachowski: Thank you, [00:31:00] Leighann

Secrets of Healthy Living for Busy Professionals

Leighann Lovely then welcomes Dr. Sal, founder of Dr. Blue Zone and retired facial plastic surgeon, for a deep dive into the health practices of those living in Blue Zones. Dr. Sal shares invaluable tips on maintaining a healthy lifestyle amidst busy schedules, emphasizing the importance of meal prepping and the dangers of modern processed foods. He also discusses his upcoming health restoration workshop, aimed at helping individuals reverse chronic diseases. You are not going to want to miss how to stay healthy in a busy world.
 
Contact- Dr.Sal
LinkedIN- https://drsalhealth.com/
Website- https://www.drblue-zone.com
Email- drsalhealth@gmail.ocm
 
Robb Conlon – Intro and outro – Westport Studio - https://www.westportstudiosllc.com/ 
 
The Brave Ones – Instrumental Version Song by Jan Sanejko - https://artlist.io/royalty-free-music/song/the-brave-ones/1Special 
 
Thank you to our Sponsors – Genhead – www.genhead.com and Sales Rescue – www.rescuemysales.com 
 
Ready to grow your business? Schedule a call with us today  - https://api.leadconnectorhq.com/widget/bookings/discoverysalesleighann
 
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Leighann Lovely: Welcome to another episode of love your sales today. I am joined by Dr. Sal, the founder of Dr. Blue zone. He is a retired. E and T and facial plastic surgeon, as well as a competitive bodybuilder who is empowering Americans to take charge of their health.
And I am completely thrilled to have you here with me, Dr. Sal. , you and I previously [00:02:00] talked and I am really excited to just, you know, pick your brain and learn a little bit about what you do and how you do it. 
Dr. Sal: William, thank you so much for having me on your show. I mean, it's truly an honor, um, to try to help and expand the awareness of the health issues that are taking place in America, and I'm trying to be instrumental in making those changes and really getting people to.
not only take charge of their own health, but also to feel better about themselves, uh, psychologically, emotionally, hopefully spiritually too as well. And for me as a physician physically. 
Leighann Lovely: And that's such a hard, it's, it's hard to Stay on top of being and living healthy when we are living in a world where people are constantly jumping from One thing to the next in the busy lives we live, right?
As a mother, as an entrepreneur, as a salesperson, [00:03:00] Um, there are days where I'm like, oh my gosh, I forgot to eat. Let me just grab the closest most unhealthy thing that's within reach and then continue on to whatever is next, dropping my daughter off at dance, going to an appointment or whatever it might be.
So I am excited to talk about, you know, some of those tips and tricks, but before we do that, What is Dr. Blue Zone? 
Dr. Sal: Well, the blue zone is an area in the world where people, uh, live to be a hundred years old and older, but they're completely functional. I'm talking about people that are 99, a hundred, 101, 102 years old, completely functional.
They're walking, they're walking up the mountain. , they're going out to their farmlands. Uh, the women may be going to the, grocery store or, you know, the little market where they, you know, may buy some of their, you know, foods for [00:04:00] home. And they're walking a quarter mile and carrying their, their groceries back home.
Dr. Sal: So men and women are functional, even at the age of 95, we, we don't, we can't even imagine living to 95 these days. Let alone if you make it to 95, you might be in an extended care facility. You know, with Alzheimer's for the last 10 years of your life, you're not functional. And one of the keys that I'm trying to get Americans to be aware of is that it's one thing to live to be 100.
But you want to be completely functional until you pass. At a hundred years old. The reason why I bring this and the reason why I'm on this quest to try to get people to that area is number one. My family came from that area. My, my parents were immigrants from Italy. My great grandmother lived to be 99 years old.
I went to go see her in 1987. And as I was pulling up the driveway in the farm where they live. [00:05:00] She was 92 years old working outside and you've got feet, you know, 55 year olds walking with walkers, getting total knees, total hip replacement on diabetic medication. Their kidneys are failing. I mean, so the key is, is how do we bring this knowledge to where we're at today?
And it's because of my educational background with the Jesuits. When I went to college, when I was studying biology and everything was compare and contrast. Transcribed And we have to compare and contrast the lifestyle of America in 1850 to where we're at today. Now, it sounds kind of odd, but being from Detroit and I moved here to Arizona in December.
But being in Detroit, I went to the Henry Ford Museum at least 30 times. And it's a fascinating place. So for any of you listeners out there, if you ever go to Detroit, you have to go to the Henry Ford Museum. It's a [00:06:00] two day affair. Go during the summer months where you can go to the indoor museum and the outdoor museum.
The outdoor museum, Henry Ford specifically started to see how the automotive industry was changing the face of the world. And he was saying, wait a minute, the way of life that I knew growing up as a kid is changing. Now he hated the farm life. It was fascinating. If you read the story of Henry Ford, he, you know, as cars were growing and big cities were developing during the industrial revolution, people were getting away from the farmlands.
It was fascinating. And what he was advocating is, hey, if you got your Aunt Millie, you know, take the car that you made working in my factory and now that you're making a good living and you got the weekend off, go visit your Aunt Millie and go work on the farm for a little bit. The stuff that he hated, he now didn't want people to lose [00:07:00] and the beauty of that was, is that you start to see how Americans lived in the 1850s, 1860s, 1870s.
It's the industrial revolution that started changing things. And of course it was gradual, and of course this is where we're at today. Right. And you ask yourself, if we had antibiotics and ventilators, which were two major changes in the medical industry that really kept us living a little bit longer. So you didn't die of a tooth infection.
Right. But, you know, you take my grandparents and my great grandparents, they went through two world wars, Spanish flu, they had no antibiotics, no vaccines. No ventilators. I mean, they were, they would go days without food because during the wars, everything would get bombed and they have to escape, live up in the mountains.
And you ask yourself, how did these people live this way? Now, last year, I made it a point to travel across America three times in my Ford expedition. And I thought about this, you would stop and I was going through the [00:08:00] former Route 66, which is now turned into interstate highways. 
Leighann Lovely: Mm hmm. 
Dr. Sal: Great movie to watch is cars.
The first cars, you know, when the, the lady Porsche attorney says, yeah, this is where the old route 66, it used to go through these towns and everybody was happy because we could service people. Now they, you know, just to cut 10 minutes, they created the, well, I went through those towns and it was sad because.
They abandoned hotels and actually motels, you know, restaurants. I mean, that area. And I'm thinking, Oh, my God, this is like the movie cars. But then I started thinking to myself, how did Americans when Henry Ford made the cars available to people travel across America on dirt roads. You didn't know where the next gas station was.
You didn't know where the next. Subway or pizzeria or McDonald's was there. I mean, we, we've got a pretty bad. I mean, we have air conditioning. I got serious radio, [00:09:00] you know, I got a nice comfortable car. They didn't have that available to them back then, but where we think, oh, I'll just stop and pick up a hamburger.
Well, we will. Wait a minute now. What is that doing to our overall health? And so, if Americans realize, wait a minute, is the way I'm living truly a healthy way of living? And in my thinking about where I'm going to be when I'm 70 or 80 years old, if I make it that long anymore, and that's my concern for Americans because we all think, well, I got my health insurance card and I got my doctor and they're not there to restore your health.
They're there to take care of your sickness and disease. And that's why some of my friends that I, we now call it sick care. You get sick, go to the doctor, he gives you a drug, and it really just treats it, doesn't cure the problem. 
Leighann Lovely: Yes, and that, that is, that seems to be, right. Very few [00:10:00] people, well, , I'm not very few, I mean, most of the people I know, they go to the doctor once a year for what they consider to be their checkup, their wellness visit, but then any other time that you ever go to the doctor, you're going there, Because you're sick, right?
But it's not about preventative care. It's about let's put a band aid on or let's give you a shot or an antibiotic for XYZ. But at the same time, who out there is actually saying, Why don't we try to heal the body instead of just give more medication? I, there has been multiple times where I've gone in and I'm like, well, I've got this pain, I've got this pain.
And doctors are like, yeah, we can't really see anything that's wrong with you. Here's some pain medication. , , I didn't, I don't really want pain medication. I want you to figure out why. I have pain and doctors, well, we, don't know. It's just a phantom, you know, but we can't find it. We could run this test.
We can put you through, you know, an MRI, a CT and it's like, oh, okay, so you can, you can spend 50, [00:11:00] 000 of my insurance money in my out of pocket. And then at the end of the day, you're going to say, well, You know, the only thing we can do is give you a shot, but never solve the problem?
Dr. Sal: Well, and this is very typical, and this is why I tell people, go into the emergency room.
The emergency rooms were really devised for heart attacks, cardiac arrests, respiratory arrests, shortness of breath, car accidents, for trauma. If you go see your family doctor, then it may be a process. It may be a process. Um. Right. Where, you know, they might say, well, I don't know what's going on. I can't see anything clinically on in your body.
But then again, it, but the doctors are, there are some doctors out there that will tell people to change their lifestyle. And Americans won't do that. So there's this, 
Leighann Lovely: they don't know how, 
Dr. Sal: because 
Leighann Lovely: nobody has ever, you [00:12:00] know, you grow up with parents who, you know, going to McDonald's is a treat, it's a special thing.
And then you get to an age where you're like, well, now I get to go whenever I want. And it becomes that habit or it becomes the convenience, the convenience store, you know, the, the gas stations where you can stop in, you can buy your lunch. It's, you know, reasonably priced but you don't realize what you're putting in your body and the long term ramifications until all of a sudden you've gained an additional 20 pounds and you're middle aged or you're an additional, you know, 60 pounds.
You're middle aged and that weight does not come off and the ramifications of that has never really truly been talked about in a way That it raises a red flag that, hey, this could, cut your short, your life shorter. The other thing is, that people don't, it'll never happen to me is the mentality of the [00:13:00] US.
Oh, you know, a dear friend of mine just got breast cancer, but that'll never happen to me until one day it does. And then everybody's like, Oh, I'm so sorry, this has happened to you, know, kidney failure because you drank, you know, mass quantities of alcohol your entire life or, you know, liver damage, whatever it might be, it'll never happen to me until it does it, you know, and it happens to hundreds of thousands of people.
Every day. That number might be wrong. I'm not a, I'm not a doctor. I'm not, I don't, but I'm going to guess that on, on a regular basis, people are dying of these common things we hear about all of the time. My parents told me, you know, Hey, my dad said, you know, I lost three of my uncles to lung cancer. Don't ever smoke.
What do you do as a kid? You're like, well, I'm going to pick up my first cigarette and I'm going to see what it's all about. Not so much. Today, now that we have like, you know, the rise of the vapes, but those, what are those doing to our lungs? It's even worse. [00:14:00] So let's talk about how do you start working with somebody to even begin?
And what are some of those key factors that, for instance, the blue zones, why is it that they, you know, what elements is it? Is it truly? The. being, you know, in that particular area, or is it because that particular area doesn't produce the high fructose corn syrups or what's the trick? 
Dr. Sal: Well, you know, I, I'll answer that question by starting off with the movie twins.
With Arnold Schwarzenegger and Danny DeVito. 
Leighann Lovely: Yes. 
Dr. Sal: And, you know, if you recall in the movie, uh, they go visit the doctor that kind of inseminated the woman with all this DNA modification, you know, with the idea that they were going to produce this superhuman baby, right? That's going to grow up and, you know, But then ends up happening is that the woman has [00:15:00] twins and one's this beautiful, blonde, you know, tall.
And then the other one's the short one, which was Danny DeVito. And of course they separated them. The project came to an end. The mother went to, you know, she went to the mainland and so Arnold grows up in this island. Well, seeks out his brother, which is Danny DeVito, a little wild and crazy, you know, had to live through orphanages and so forth.
It was an interesting story. I mean, really a great movie. But they go visit the doctor that was in charge of this experiment. And he looks at Danny DeVito and he says, listen, you were just the genetic garbage. He's the guy that turned out to be perfect. And then Danny DeVito finally came to the realize realization.
Wait a minute. We are twin brothers. This, this is really true. What my brother Arnold was telling me, and I can't remember. You know, their names in the Julius, I think was his name. Arnold played Julius and, so he walks outside and Arnold comes and he [00:16:00] puts his arm around him. He says, you're not genetic.
He said, I see the world that you're living in. You're running around. You're having nuked food. He says, you're grabbing this up. He said, I came from a paradise island. I was loved. I was cared for. I was educated. I was fed great food, healthy food. He said, you, you live in this world where you're running around and you're, you're trying to hustle and you're grabbing whatever you can and you got relationships and people are coming after you.
This is all messed up. He says, but you are still my brother and it came, you know, that movie was such an example of what I'm trying to exploit. And that is, is that, and I gave lectures with Peter hut. It was the head of the FDA for for many, many years. And it's the food and drug administration. So just keep that in mind.
I'm not going to say anything about it. Okay, but I kind of put myself in [00:17:00] Jesus's place and I try to tell people I'm not here to save you. I'm not here. Like, oh, you got to turn your life to Jesus. But I listened to what Jesus says. And what he did, he didn't change the Roman empire. He didn't change the Pharisees.
He didn't change the establishment, but what he was telling everybody is, look, I love you. I just hate your ways. And if you could change your ways now, here's the whole thing. Now, getting back to the question that you asked us, what is it that these people have in the blue zone? Number one, they live on islands.
There's not very much manufacturing going on in those islands and these people live like they did before the 1850s. They get up, they tend to their sheep, they go to their farm, they eat off the lamb, the sheep are eating grass fed, you know, they're grass fed sheep and animals where there's no pesticides, there's no GMOs.
There's no chemicals. There's no food [00:18:00] colorings. You say, yeah, but their livelihood is very limited. They don't have access to Tostitos and Doritos and Cheetos and Fritos and everything that ends with eatos. They don't have access to Coca Cola and seven up and Sprite and ginger ale, all filled with corn syrup.
They don't eat, you know, breakfast cereal out of a box. So grab an egg that was just laid, cracked the top and drink the egg raw. And you see these old ladies, my great aunts used to do that. They would have cheese and say, Oh, but Jesus fat, healthy fat, you know, they would get the goat's milk. They would make their own cheese.
They would slaughter their own animals. Um, they weren't drinking pop. They were drinking water. And maybe when they were young, like my grandfather, he says, Oh, I don't drink milk. That's for babies after a certain age. You know, he ate cheese. He didn't drink milk and only drink was coffee, wine and water.
And the wine was homemade wine. You [00:19:00] know, I mean, they had to make everything from scratch. Now you're saying, but Dr. Sal, look at the lifestyle that we live. And what I'm trying to say is, is that you we got to start cooking at home. Now, if you come from a small town where you don't have a whole foods or a sprouts or a times which, you know, where they carry organic foods, Then I always tell everybody shop around the periphery where you get your meat, your dairy, your eggs, your vegetables, your fruits.
That's the only place you should shop. Do not go in the aisles where things are canned, boxed or bagged with colors, preservatives, flavorings, additives, stuff that's added in there that God never intended for us to eat. 
Leighann Lovely: Right. Now, what is the point of putting coloring in food? 
Dr. Sal: Well, here's what's happening in the food industry as time has progressed.
And that was one of the interesting things that when you go to the Henry [00:20:00] Ford Museum and you start to see, they show these little videos of like the 1950s. When, oh my gosh, we now have a convention, you know, convention iron, I mean, oven, you know, you don't have to put fire or you don't have to put wood in the stove and get the, like my great grandmother used to do, you know, everything is all look, you just turn on the switch and you know, you've got the electric stove and you could cook your food quicker.
So what's happened is, is that as time went on, is the food industry said, well, how can we make it simple for a woman to make a cake? Right. So 
Leighann Lovely: , the simpler we've made it, the more chemicals, the more yes, that we've added in to our own world. I mean, really the reality of it is that our world, you, you create a cost.
It faster, more efficient. Now it has more admissions that we are now breathing in, which is all great. But the [00:21:00] ramifications that it has then on the human body. And that's, and that's awesome. So ultimately, it comes down to what you can control.
Dr. Sal: And that now, that's what makes it more challenging for we Americans.
Because 
Dr. Sal: we're 5 percent of the population consuming 85 percent of the pharmaceutical drugs of the world. We are that small of a population that's consuming more pharmaceutical drugs than any other country in the world. And you have to ask yourself, but Dr. Sal, I gotta really work at this. And what I'm trying to tell you is, Just so you don't spend the last six months of your life withering and rotting away in a hospital bed, because that's what I saw for 30 years.
And in the 30 years that I was practicing through the hospitals, it kept getting worse and worse and worse. Now we have these L techs, which I used to work as I used to manage the airways. And we could keep people alive for four or five, [00:22:00] six months versus when I started my internship in 1990, you know, once you couldn't make it past the intensive care unit, you were done.
Maybe we could send you to an extended care facility. Now, they're putting them in the hospitals as L techs, literally one floor where we can keep you on a ventilator for four or five months. Even though you can't really breathe on your own, and we start pumping you with 22, 24, 26 different drugs. Once we get you over one hump, something else happens, because now the system is completely dysfunctional.
We're talking about the body. And I'm saying, this is what we're doing to human beings, and this is what people don't see. I used to walk into a room, and I would see a patient just looking out the window with all these problems. And I had to walk out because I didn't want to interrupt them because what was going through their mind was, what is this where my life has brought me?
And it's the pain of regret that's more painful than the [00:23:00] pain of discipline. And that's what I tell everybody, hey, to discipline yourself to do this. It is a headache. It's extra work, but in the long run, you can make it to 95, work in your garage, play with your grandchildren, you know, and I tell everybody have sex with your wife at 95, go to bed and not wake up in the morning.
The next thing you know, you're fighting yourself in heaven. I mean, that, I mean, that's the ideal way to go, but I could see if you had to suffer the last two weeks of your life in a hospital. That's where a hundred years ago, hospitals were designed for literally for people to die. Yeah. And so they sent you there just to make you comfortable.
They didn't have the IVs like we had today. They didn't have the medications like we had today. They made you comfortable, but it wasn't this prolonged four to six months. And then prior to that, for the last 10, 15 years, you were suffering with kidney disorder where you had a kidney renal dialysis, [00:24:00] uh, you know, your diabetes, and you were on these medications and you had the side effects.
Leighann Lovely: Right. So how does again, you know, I, I know you have, we'll get to this in a second where you can get your shameless plug. You have a workshop coming up, but so for those who are listening, you know, again, the busy professionals, the salespeople of the world who are constantly bouncing from place to place.
Let's, let's throw out a couple of healthy snacks that they can carry with them versus stopping at a gas station and grabbing a, which is what I do, you know, grabbing a sandwich off the shelf, you know, a hot one of their hot sandwiches or stopping at a fast food restaurant. What are some of the healthy snacks that they could bring with them, whether that be organic carrots or, vegetables.
You know, what is, what are some of your recommendations on that? 
Dr. Sal: Well, to start off with, one of the benefits That I've had in my life [00:25:00] is I became a competitive bodybuilder. It started off when I was 15 years old. I joined the original, the original powerhouse gym in Detroit. And there was this guy who was managing the gym.
We didn't have trainers like you have today. Okay. You bought the book, you read the book, you bought the muscle magazines and you went in there and you started exercising. You watch these other guys who were competitive bodybuilders and you watch them with, Hey, what's this exit? And it was. It's like a kid picking up a guitar without taking guitar lessons and he hangs out with a bunch of guitars and he's just picking up how to play it.
And then you've actually learned that you become Stevie Ray Vaughan. You know, and that's how he learned it. He didn't, he didn't take any formal lessons, but there's black gentlemen by the name of LeVon Hall was cut. He just moved in from California to start working at this gym. And of course it was a little raffle in a wall.
You know, it wasn't like these big, huge gyms. Like we have today, the lifetime fitness is the EOS that I trained here is the smallest one, and they got a thousand people going to it a [00:26:00] day. And he said, Sal, 85 percent of bodybuilding is what you eat. But then you have to learn, you have to make your protein shakes.
You have to meal prep. So if you didn't have that much time in the morning and you had to have your four eggs, you didn't have time. Okay, on a Sunday, I would boil two dozen eggs and I'd have hard boiled eggs. And, you know, then I would shell them the night before and get them ready. So for breakfast in the morning, I'm walking out of the house.
And I got my hard boiled eggs and I could bring some, you know, a bag of raw nuts and I have my coffee and of course I use heavy cream in my coffee with stevia as a sweetener. None of the artificial sweeteners, no sugar. Stevia is a natural, uh, plant, like a peppermint plant, natural sweetener doesn't spike your insulin.
So it's called meal prepping. So you've got to take at least 15, 20 minutes at night, even making an omelet, make your omelet at night. So whatever leftover [00:27:00] steak you have with some eggs and onions, you throw a little cheese in there. You make your steak and egg omelet. That's it. And if you've got to go somewhere now, the beauty of it is, is that I traveled on a plane recently and it was a lady that actually brought her own food.
Right. And I'm like, oh, can you do that now? She says, yeah, like, great, but you can't bring any liquids. Okay. So the protein shakes. So you meal prep and you buy these little containers. I prefer putting everything in glass, of course, but if you are traveling, you could put it in a little plastic container and you could bring it with you on the plane.
And so instead of eating food that's coming out of the airport or what's on the plane, you could bring your own food. Now, sometimes I say, well, I'm leaving at 1 o'clock in the afternoon here, Arizona time, or let's say 10 o'clock in the morning. I'll have breakfast. And then I'll get to Detroit and I'll have dinner with my mother.
Dr. Sal: And of course, she eats at home all the time. She's 85. Her sister's 87. My mother doesn't even go out to the restaurants, man. She [00:28:00] will not eat that stuff. But then again, she's 85 years old, no health issues. So eating at home and knowing what you're cooking with, and then of course, we refine what you use at home to cook with.
But, you know, going to certain stores where you could buy , raw pistachios, walnuts, brazil nuts, , pumpkin seeds and put that in a bag that could hold you over until you get to your destination. 
Leighann Lovely: Right. 
Dr. Sal: You know, and then when you get your, to your destination, if you're staying at a hotel, you want to look for a place that has a nice restaurant.
Now, of course I, I get picky with the restaurants. I mean, I, I go in the back and I'll ask the chef or the cook, I'll say, what kind of oil are you using? And they show me this oil in a plastic bottle. I says, where's it coming from? I mean, son of a gun, 
Leighann Lovely: here, here, it's just random oil. 
Dr. Sal: You know why? Because these oils are trans fats.
[00:29:00] That's a killer. That's a kill. Forget this idea that it's a saturated fats. That was proven in 1957 by Fred Coomberall, but no doctor or cardiologist is going to tell you that today. Mm hmm. These are things that are forgotten. I mean, Otto Warnberg out of Germany in the 1920s says it's sugar that causes these cancers.
And we were sugar laden and cancers on the rise, trans fats, a top on top of the heavy metals and the chemicals and so forth. So meal prepping is very important. So if you have a busy lifestyle, you have to start meal prepping at home, right? And I mean, who can't make some eggs and say, well, look, I don't have breakfast at 6 o'clock in the morning, but I got to be out of the house by 6.
Like, okay, make it at night with you at work and try to get try to get a toaster oven as opposed to a microwave. So you see these little changes that you start making at [00:30:00] work. And saying, Oh, he's got to use the toaster oven. That's right. Oh, you can't have a slice of pizza. That's right. I'm getting ready for a competition.
Leighann Lovely: Right? Listen, 
Dr. Sal: I got a health issue. I'm trying to take care of my body. I'll eat the way I want to eat. And you know what I learned in life? It's not selfish to do what you want to do. It's selfish when you tell other people how to live their life. Now you say, but you must be a selfish guy because you're telling people, because as a doctor, I know that what you're doing right now is causing damage to your health overall.
And we have these health issues in America. We have to address them. 
Leighann Lovely: So that, that is great advice, Neil. I mean, some of the stuff that you listed, I mean, the, all the different kinds of nuts and all of, I, I absolutely love, it's one of my favorite snacks is, is just getting a handful of nuts and almonds or, um, I don't know, or almonds.
I love almonds. Yes. 
Dr. Sal: Almonds. I mean, walnuts, your [00:31:00] pistachios, your Brazil nuts, but just throwing in a little plastic baggie. Right. Thank you. And, you know, that's what you're going to snack on when you're traveling, 
Leighann Lovely: right? And those are all, I mean, those are really great ideas just to hold you over, especially if you are constantly, especially if you're a salesperson who's just on the road, you know, traveling during the daytime instead of, and that's also a money saver.
If you're, instead of stopping at the gas station, instead of stopping at a fast food restaurant, right? Yeah. Those are just a little, a couple of little tips and tricks of, of not only being healthier, but saving money because you can buy that in bulk and then, you know, carry that with you. So those are some great tips.
We are coming to time. I want to give you your 32nd shameless pitch. I know that you have a workshop coming up, so, you know, tell us a little bit about that and um, yeah, and we'll, make sure that we get that information out there too. 
Dr. Sal: Well, the workshop is going to be a two and a half hour workshop where I'm going to be talking and it's it's a it's a part one [00:32:00] phase workshop because it's Two and a half hours.
Really, I cannot talk about everything in two and a half hours, but the objective is, is it's how to start getting on a health restoration program. If you have diabetes, if you have hypertension, if you're overweight, if you have kidney problems, if you have neurologic disorders, we can help you reverse that.
Now it's a start to get you in and eventually get you into a program where we literally follow you for 6 to 12 months. It's personalized to the individual and we use from diet modifications to supplements to peptides, hormones, all of these things that we get you to do, uh, chelation therapy, all of this stuff, literally clean your body out, get you to start changing your ways, which takes time to do, and then watch these diseases just eventually fade away.
Leighann Lovely: Amazing. And if somebody is interested [00:33:00] in, learning how they can sign up for that, is that on your website? , where are they? 
Dr. Sal: We're going to have that on the website, and it's going to be drblue zone. com, blue zone. com. And we'll have a, um, a location there, a link that you can help join you. It'll get you to join, So that you can sign up for it.
 And then from there, you know, it'll tell you what you need to do fill out whatever forms that you have to fill out. And so you can attend it. It will be. Uh, 12 o'clock Mountain Standard time, which is really right now Yukon time, which is specific. So it would be 3 o'clock Eastern time and 2 o'clock Central Standard time.
So it's going to be about 2 and a half hours. It's going to be great. You know, there's going to be times where people can ask questions. And then hopefully get people to start being more aware. It's [00:34:00] time for us Americans to really start taking charge. Right. You can't, you can't expect some old man with a white beard to come out of the sky and come and save you.
And you can't pray the, our father who art in Washington, that's going to fix everything. We really have to take on the mentality of what our founding fathers taught us. And that is we take charge of our own life, but you'll feel better overall with everything that you do. Because then you could claim that this is mine.
Leighann Lovely: Awesome. So yeah, Dr. Sal, I really appreciate you coming on and I hope that, , everybody has gotten, you know, a couple of tips and tricks that they can walk away with to live a healthier lifestyle, especially as salespeople, entrepreneurs who are constantly on the go. I know that, I need better, you know, healthier, you know, ways.
So I, I do really appreciate your time today. 
Dr. Sal: Well, you know what, Leanne? It's, it's a great day for you because you have me as your friend, so anytime you, you got my phone [00:35:00] number, so you call me, okay? 
Leighann Lovely: I definitely will take you up on that. 
Dr. Sal: All right, well, thank you so much for having me on your show.

Mastering Sales with Customer-Centric Strategies

YouTube Full - https://youtu.be/ggNKOuTJsp4
YouTube Clip - https://youtu.be/9F_LF4aqyd4
YouTube Short – https://youtube.com/shorts/qyx7w3EP1Ss?feature=share
 
Mastering Sales with Customer-Centric Strategies
On this episode of 'Love Your Sales,' host Leighann Lovely engages in a dynamic discussion with global sales expert William Gilchrist, founder and CEO of Konsyg. They delve into the intricacies of effective sales strategies, particularly emphasizing the importance of understanding customer needs over mere product details. William shares enlightening anecdotes, illustrating how listening and aligning value propositions with client necessities can turn conversations into conversions. The conversation also tackles the oft-overlooked challenges faced by sales professionals and the misconceptions stakeholders have about the sales process. Wrapping up with invaluable tips and experiences, this episode is a must-listen for anyone looking to excel in sales and business development.
Contact - WilliamLinkedIN - https://sg.linkedin.com/in/williamgilchristkonsyg
Wedsite - www.konsyg.comEmail - william@konsyg.com
 
Special Thank you to our Sponsors – Genhead – www.genhead.com and Sales Rescue – www.rescuemysales.com
Robb Conlon – Intro and outro – Westport Studio - https://www.westportstudiosllc.com/
The Brave Ones – Instrumental Version Song by Jan Sanejko - https://artlist.io/royalty-free-music/song/the-brave-ones/119489
 
Ready to grow your business? Schedule a call with us today  - https://api.leadconnectorhq.com/widget/bookings/discoverysalesleighann
 
Leighann Lovely: I am joined today by William Gilchrist.
He's an individual with an amazing, background, a career spanning over 15 years in technology sales across North America, Europe, the Middle East, uh, and Asia Pacific . William stands as a global authority in his field currently as a visionary founder of Konsyg, William oversees comprehensive sales processes for enterprises [00:02:00] and SMEs on a global scale. William, I am so thrilled to have you join me today.
William Gilchrist: And thanks so much for having me.
Leighann Lovely: Yes. And right now it is morning for me and it is evening for you because you are actually recording with me from Singapore.
William Gilchrist: Absolutely. It's a normal occurrence when I'm talking to my fellow country people that I'm always getting the short end of the stick of the hours every time. Night 2, 3 a. m. 10 p. m. It's, it's never, uh, in reverse.
Leighann Lovely: Yes. So why don't we dive right in? Why don't you tell me a little bit more about who you are, what you do and, um, yeah, we'll start talking about some fun, fun stories of, of sales and, and learn more about your, your background.
And, you know, I, I'm going to say that, you know, sales on a global level is not for the faint of [00:03:00] heart.
William Gilchrist: Absolutely. I mean, I guess who I am and what we do, uh, well, I am the founder and CEO of Consig headquartered in Singapore, , which effectively means I'm a glorified janitor. , that's really what it is.
I always tell people I run custodial services for Consig pretty much, uh, putting out fires, you know, cleaning the toilets and things like that. And we're really just, Managing the entire sales organization. And what Consig is, is a sales organization, more commonly known these days, which I'm really proud of as sales mercenaries.
So we're a mercenary group of salespeople that effectively takes contracts with, with large businesses, um, enterprises, even some governments, and what we do is we build revenue for them by being there on demand sales team globally. So that could be used for go to market strategies in the new markets or helping people that aren't necessarily that successful in their home markets or really at the end of the day [00:04:00] just competing with their current sales team sometimes if they have them just to see how their current sales team is measuring up.
So we kind of cover all different angles of the sales process end to end. And that's what we've been doing for the last eight years.
Leighann Lovely: That is amazing. I love that. , my audience knows that, you know, we, I, I play in that same space. And so I'm going to ask you a question that I've been asked, um, you know, a million and 10 times, how do you all of the sudden just take on, you know, becoming a sales person for.
a new company and learn their process and you know, how do you do that? Um, you, got to be able to wear so many different hats and learn processes and learn products. And so explain how that works.
William Gilchrist: There's so many layers to that. I mean, one, when it comes down to, selling a product, ultimately [00:05:00] sales is a value proposition and that's universal across all industries and all human beings, right?
It is a human interaction, whether it's a dill pickles. cheeseburgers or a VCR that's outdated. It's all based on what the value proposition is. And are you actually applying that value proposition to a person who needs it? The key part of that sentence is need. Um, so often people think that sales is like this voodoo stuff and just go out there and create deals for me.
Well, if that was the case, um, anybody could do it. It's more about, you know, Finding the right people who might have a need for a value proposition that our clients have, and then us having very educated business conversations to be able to attach that need to the value proposition. And a lot of that is just outreach.
And really being smart about the market to be able to know who to speak to who would actually care about [00:06:00] this value proposition and then moving it through the pipe that can go for cyber security, e commerce, med tech, mark tech, crypto after that, then you get to the complexities. One of the most common questions that our new clients always ask us or even prospects.
It's number one on our FAQ we put it up there on purpose. Are. Products or our service is so unique and so niche that it takes people's years to understand it. There's no way you'll be able to sell that. Well, you know, we've sold space tech before. I mean, we've sold a lot of different things that were out of our purview, but a lot of it is, do we understand the value proposition and why people need it in the market?
From there, growth happens. And this is something that people don't. Also factor in, which is as we're selling, we're constantly critiquing and getting better and understanding more about the pains in the market and how to attach that value proposition to those pains. We're not [00:07:00] engineers, but we are conversationalists.
We are pipeline managers. We know how to do outreach. We know how to have real conversations. And we know the one ultimate truth that nobody wants to admit to themselves, which is, Nobody cares about your product. They never did. And they probably never will, unless there's someone who's able to attach that value proposition to something that they actually need directly, then it sells.
Leighann Lovely: And that's, and I've said this before, to um, you know, to people that, you know, they're like, well, how are you going to sell my product? You're not an expert on it. And I'm like, I don't, I don't need to be an expert on how every intricate detail works in your product. I just have to understand the problem it solves for the people who are going to buy it.
And then everything else is going to fall into place. Like I need to be able to [00:08:00] go. know who to talk to that you already covered that know who your audience is know the problem that it solves and then be able to talk to that person on a high level on the value that the value proposit the value it brings to that person when it comes to all of the all of those fine details it's unlikely that even the client cares exactly how it Works down to that Minuscule detail they don't they don't care at the end of the day.
They want to know that if they're gonna hand over 10 100 100, 000 that it's gonna fix the problem they have and people are like, well, no, no, no, no No, you can't sell my you know Customized blah blah blah blah blah because you don't you don't get it I don't need to get it. I just need to be [00:09:00] able to present it in a way that is solving the pain points, the problems that the person experiencing them have.
And then the solution, you know, give them the solution and the results that they're going to get at the end of the day. I mean, and you said that just beautifully because we as salespeople, you know, we're I don't, need an engineer to walk me into the back and go, okay, here's all the pieces. This is why it worked.
William Gilchrist: The engineers I've seen kill deals.
Leighann Lovely: Yes.
William Gilchrist: Perfectly good deal. A lot of it's because What a lot of people don't realize is that yes, your company has a narrative. Yes. Your company has a voice. The salesperson is a bridge. It's not only the voice of you. It's also the voice of the people. So yes, if you don't necessarily get the technical details, that's good because the prospect doesn't either.
And what [00:10:00] you're going to do is to be able to translate. The complexities of the coding and the intricacies and how revolutionary it is into something real for someone that might be interested in it, even if they're in your industry, right? Oh, well, these people are highly technical individuals. Still, at the end of the day, I can have enough of a technical conversation as a salesperson to be able to get to the point.
And what people also tend to overlook. Is that in the sales process, if you have an experienced salesperson and somebody who's really good at, um, you know, getting deals on the table, as soon as someone's getting in over, like, as soon as we're over our head in a technical conversation, that's a great point to say, you know what, I think we're getting off just well here.
We need to get. Some of our technical people didn't answer those. But before I do that, if we solve these things, can you tell me a little bit why that's so important for you? Because that information is part of the sales process and part of the value proposition and part [00:11:00] of the need versus value proposition connection, which makes a deal happen.
This is commonly overlooked by so many business owners, by so many founders, even large companies, because. Even Cary Institute did a study. 92 percent of all founders have never seen a sales floor. They've never done a cold call. Right. And most initial deals that happen are usually from referrals or networks.
So they believe their sales cycles are really fast because, you know, their cousin bought it within two weeks. You know, you have the cold approach outbound sellers out there like us. They're like, most people probably don't care. In fact, most people won't even pick up the phone or you're fighting for two months to even get on their calendar.
You know, since this is a reality of the outbound seller that it gets overlooked very often when you are an individual with a product and believing that the product is going to like solve all problems in the world, which it probably could, but in order for that to happen. [00:12:00] people would actually need to see you and actually care and hear about it, which that's the sales process that people don't see.
Leighann Lovely: Right. And, and you bring up the founders that typically the founder is so into their product that they become sometimes their own worst enemy. I could sit here, you and I could sit here and talk about how, you know, as founders, we could sit here and talk about how great our service offering is over and over until we're blue in the face and be like, yeah, it's so perfect.
It's so great. You know, my, I'm trying to find something on my desk that's like, Oh, this stapler, you know, this stapler is the greatest stapler in the world because I created it and it does this and it does that. And people are like, I don't care. Does it, does it make paper stay together? And, and those founders don't, they, they get so stuck in their head, you know, and, and I'm sure you've had million client stories where they're like, I made it.
And now that I, it's, it's like, you know, [00:13:00] build it and they will come. The whole idea of, you know, the 1980s movie of Field of Dreams, you know, if, if you build it, they will, was that the 80s? Dating myself. Um, but you know, if you, if you build it, they will come. Well, no, that's not necessarily true. true if you don't know how to explain it to people at a level in which they care and a level in which they understand.
And those founders typically are not like you and I, where we're like, yeah, it's a beautiful field. You can come here and have fun with your friends and family versus here's how I did it. I took my, you know, tractor and I plowed down. I
William Gilchrist: don't, nobody's even looking at that. Right. And ultimately that's the result too of, um, yes, it's, it's a good thing that founders have a love for their product.
However, um, and there's a place
Leighann Lovely: [00:14:00] for that story too, for
William Gilchrist: that story, exactly. But also at the same time, they. A lot of people, they don't have enough respect for what sales is. There's no degree in sales. You can't get a degree in it. You need to get a degree in marketing. You get a degree in this and all, and all that stuff, but it's not like degree in sales, right?
It's a very, underappreciated kind of trade. In fact, it's not really seen as a trade. A lot of people think that it's personality and coffee and being funny here and there, and then just talking a lot, right? A lot of people believe that they don't understand the science behind it all. And it's not. The pitch, right?
We get a, we
Leighann Lovely: get a bad rap or is that what you're saying?
William Gilchrist: Oh, oh, we're considered scum. We're scum. We're absolute scum, right? You know, and, and, and the concept of a salesperson is go out there and make a sell happen. I mean, wow. That's amazing. Like, how do you force somebody to pull out their wallet? I couldn't even do that.
I was in Google for five years. Right. And like so many people would book me just so that they can get the [00:15:00] free lunch and a t shirt. But they want spending after that, you know, they just want to have an opportunity to go to the office. So people didn't even care about that. And that's Google. They don't even care about those products.
So ultimately it all comes down to just how well can you position a value prop? It, in that gets confused with how well can you position the product? And that is not the same thing, right? If you look at, um, a company like zero, for instance, well, zero. Yes, we can go into how it does invoicing, how it does bookkeeping, but it's, but that, that's not really the value proposition.
What it's doing is it's automating your back office. It's, it's, it's helping your back office. And do you have people in your back office that are doing a lot of paperwork, right? These type of things, that's the value proposition versus, Oh, wow. You know, we, we have set up an amazing invoicing system that sends auto reminders and then also at the same [00:16:00] time, yeah, yeah, that's great.
But how does. That actually helped me again, and they might not even realize that the value proposition is just totally what they need, right? That's where I think, um, the respect for sales gets removed because people don't realize that just because you got a great product and just because you love it so much does not mean that you're qualified to be able to have a sales conversation about it because you have to weaponize it with sales.
Leighann Lovely: Right. And, and to that point, I remember, um, like in my career, , I, I was selling a sales solution and my boss at that time wanted to partner with partner me with somebody who could do the demo. And I, you know, I can do my own demos. And I remember the first time I went out with somebody to, to do this.
And as we were sitting in the room, I'm watching all of, there's like four people in this demo, and I'm, I'm watching all of their eyes just kind of roll into the back of their head. And I'm going, this [00:17:00] is hor, even I was like, this is, I mean, it, it went from showing them like at a high level to Like almost a training session.
And I'm like, what are we doing? But this is where it goes, you know, where you go, I'm a salesperson too. This is a non salesperson who doesn't understand. Like the difference between let's just see the high level bells and whistles to diving into like the system and actually like going line for line.
Well, this is what this means. And I remember coming back to the office and saying and going to my boss and saying, I'm not taking. this person on any more demos. And she's like, well, why? And I'm like, because we sat there for an hour, basically doing a training session and they're never going to buy from us.
Now the sale is, is sunk. And I was the one who got in trouble because I was being [00:18:00] rude or I was being, and I'm like, why? Because I'm not considered the expert in the product. And so I'm the one who's, you know, being shunned for speaking up and they're like, well, you don't know what. What? Did
William Gilchrist: the deal happen?
Leighann Lovely: No. No. Well, well,
William Gilchrist: clearly the salesperson would be the expert if the deal actually didn't happen. Right. It's like, I'll tell you why. Right.
Leighann Lovely: But again, and that was, this was so many years ago, you know, I was early in my career, but, and it's like, I understand what you're trying to do. You want somebody who can answer those really high level questions, but to the point that you're making is that.
The sales conversation is a completely different conversation than the person who usually goes in and trains afterwards. And they don't have that same mindset. They, they're, they're in that you need to understand all of the nuances of the system, not [00:19:00] I want to sell you the system. I want you to, , you know, I want you to buy it.
They're, designed to be able to go in and train people on how to use it.
William Gilchrist: Well, you know, where they get mixed up here is why are you answering questions that weren't asked?
Leighann Lovely: Correct. Why are you, , why are you trying to, you know, give them information that they don't need right now.
William Gilchrist: Or maybe they do let them ask for it.
Right. And that's the key thing. If it hasn't come up, you know, my whole thing is that if there's ever a demo or any kind of real pitch, you should be talking 30 percent of the time and the person should be talking 70 percent of the time. And how do you do that? You can textualize every line, maybe ask questions.
In fact, we're Be Socratic for the first 20 minutes of the demo. If it's, if it's in an hour, be Socratic for the first 20 minutes and just simply ask questions. Right. Talk a little bit more about your, your area. How, how are you guys covering [00:20:00] this? Do you guys already have something like this? Maybe do, um, a fall on your own blade play, which is, you know, there's a good chance you might not need this at all.
Out of curiosity, what are you doing in this particular area? Right. You guys already have these systems? I mean, these are tactics of sales that would surprise, let's say, a founder. You told them that you might not need this. It's like, oh, don't worry. Once we get into what this is, we'll know whether or not that's true.
Because we want to see effectively how This person currently handles their systems. And maybe this is something that could make that one push of a button. And that's called a value proposition. That's contextualized to what they're doing and not talking about how amazing your products are. And, you know, unfortunately, I make it for your listeners.
We, let's try to clarify that it doesn't mean salespeople are not. knowledgeable about products, but they're knowledgeable for the purposes of a sales conversation, not for the purposes of implementation and [00:21:00] technicalities, right? It's really about the business component of things. And being an engineer does not mean you're a business person and being a salesperson doesn't make you an engineer.
People accept that one, but they don't accept the other way. And that's where things get a little bit confused.
Leighann Lovely: Right. No, absolutely. And, and here's, here's the funniest, some of the, the best and the greatest sales that I've ever had. I went in and. barely ever spoke. Barely, especially, especially just a couple of years ago, right after the pandemic and things started to open up again and everybody had been cramped up and no, no personal in person meetings had been happening.
Um, and I was meet during that time, I was meeting with a lot of HR people. And so I'd find, I'd go in and I'd sit down and it was an hour long of this HR. individual just talking, literally just finally having the [00:22:00] opportunity to be in the room with another human and just, you know, talking about like all of the stuff that had just happened and venting.
And then they, you know, at the end, you know, the hour would be approaching and I'd go, okay, so are we, are we good to go? You, you want to sign? Oh yeah, I'll sign that real quick and we can get started. And I'm like, great. Like, I mean, because sometimes that's what people need is just, They just want to vent.
They want to be heard. They want to, and then just, you know, and again, I'm not saying for every, some products are obviously highly more technical. I was selling, you know, at that time I was doing staffing services. There was no upfront fee, much easier sale. You go and you get a signature, you start working on it, you get paid.
You know, after doesn't work the same way when you're selling a product that you have to drop 130, 000 before you actually get started. But there, you know, there were times where it was, I would just go on and I'd, [00:23:00] Talk maybe 5 percent of the time just to let him know I was listening and it was like, Oh, okay.
All right, great. We'll get started on that for you.
William Gilchrist: Absolutely. I mean, you know, I was at a pitch one time where, , and it was in the Middle East and, and it was an hour meeting and the guy went, I timed it, he went 52 minutes. of explaining why he absolutely does not need this. I don't need this. We have this.
We have that. And I'm amazing. And you know, you see my car outside and blah, blah, blah. He went 52 minutes. I was looking at my watch the whole time, just like watching him talk. And then right when we got around the 52 minute mark, I said, okay, well, great. Um, well, you know, I'm sure you got it all figured out.
Everything sounds perfect. If you could change like three things, What would it be? And those three things ended up being the only thing I focused on for the final eight minutes, and we got a deal. You know, we went from all that [00:24:00] hot air to, okay, well, let's get down to a need. Are you saying there's nothing you would want to change?
What is one thing, even one? I said name three, but give me one thing you would want to change if you could, if you had all the money in the world and just the utopia, just humor me because I know I'm leaving and I know you need all this and I understand you got a Bentley outside. I, I get it. I get it. I don't have a Bentley outside but you do and you're so busy I understand, but if you could just humor me.
If there's one thing you could change what would it be. And the conversation changed pretty quickly, right? And it went, well, if you could, you know, the ego, well, if you could change this, then I'll do a contract with you. I'm like, well, that was actually the first thing I was going to tell you that we actually do.
And if you're saying that that matters to you, well, look, that's what it would cost. And then we can sign a contract. We were good to go, you know, and these type of things happen, which is the point of, I could very easily have been an engineer there and say, no, no, no, but that's not true. No, no, no, but this is not [00:25:00] true.
You know, when you said that, well, we're better than this. Even though you said that you're happy with this, but we're better than those are horrible sales tactics. Let's get into what you don't have. Let's get into what you need to change. Let's get into an actual need based value prop that always a reality check for all sales.
Leighann Lovely: Right. And that's, and that's the thing about salespeople is that we turn around and we validate people. We don't argue with. You know, I'm not, I'm not there to try to argue with what you already believe to be true in your head. I want to, I want to validate you. I want to find out where your pain points are.
I then want to guide you to how we can assist you. And if that matches, you know, if all of those things align and match great, but you're right, engineers, highly technical people, they're, they're going to challenge. Because that's their, that is their. personality. That's, that's what they do. That's what they're supposed to [00:26:00] do.
Otherwise, they wouldn't be good at their job if they're constantly just like, Yeah, okay, we can go with that. Well, that's, that's not the kind of engineer, you know, it's, it's not the kind of guy that I want, you know, doing any fixing work at my house, or any type of, I want to make sure that he's challenging everything and making sure that it gets fixed.
I don't want somebody who's just gonna go, Oh, this looks good.
William Gilchrist: Well, you know, I always say like, you know, if you have a prospect that is currently shopping on I'm right. com, just let them go with it, you know, just let them keep shopping on I'm right. com and let's figure out, you know, what item is not on that store.
And let's talk about the item that's not on I'm right. That comp, right. And then from there we can actually shop on another site, which is your product. Right. Yeah. Um, those are things that, you know, I think are most important in terms of understanding a sales narrative and what I call weaponizing a product, weaponizing it for a sales space, you're able to actually [00:27:00] have real conversations and it changes.
Because you're dealing with different personalities, different buying structures, also different power distances, like the way companies make decisions. You might have an individual, which is the most common, that absolutely needs your product, but the person that they report to just is absent, not very engaged, or doesn't care, doesn't really have a vested interest in things.
So now you're doing a multiple sale. Now you're doing multiple value proposition moments. And the product. is not going to cut it. It's not going to go through all those different layers because you have to sell need based value propositions across multiple titles, and then good luck in procurement. If you can, you can, right?
So all of that is, uh, part of the game that gets overlooked.
Leighann Lovely: And isn't that the most frustrating thing when you go in, you do your presentation, you meet with everybody, and then you find out that you're not sitting in front of the person that is actually going to be making the decision, or the person who's going to be signing off on everything, and you go, [00:28:00] what?
William Gilchrist: Oh, you mean Wednesday morning? I'm sorry, but every day,
Leighann Lovely: right? It's like, wait, wait, I'm sorry. You, and I've been led to believe in multiple situations where, oh yeah, I'm, I'm the decision maker. I'm going to be the one that's making the final decision. You are, is there anybody else in part of your team who needs to be part of this?
No, no. Okay, great. And then come to find out, okay, we're going to review this with the rest of the team.
William Gilchrist: Yep.
Leighann Lovely: I'm sorry. Making this decision. So you're going to go now sell my product to the rest of your team to make this decision.
William Gilchrist: That's one of the most common scenarios or people gathering a bunch of proposals, wasting all your time and then disappearing.
Right. And yeah, they're reselling it internally. And that's due to the fact that Um, a lot of companies aren't structured very well. That's something that, you know, and it's not that individual's fault, they just can't get things through. And [00:29:00] it's very difficult to be able to, they have to keep championing and then magically the Wizard of Oz behind the curtain doesn't want to meet with the salesperson, doesn't want to meet with you, but they want a proposal.
Everybody wants a proposal, wants figures and all that and be able to. Connect their own dots without actually knowing much about it. That's why companies struggle is because the real connections and communications are starting to fade a bit. And that's due to, you know, phone trees it's due to spam boxes.
It's due to all this stuff to keep. Salespeople from having sales conversations with the right people. All those walls are coming up and what you're finding is, and you're seeing it in the news that companies are slowly failing because one, either they're not adopting new products or they're not even really innovative enough because they haven't been exposed to new things and they're just keep.
They just keep working with what they have and using archaic systems, archaic blogs and things like that. [00:30:00] They have their internal sales structure and all that. I always find that to be adorable. Like what methodology are you guys using today? Right. And all of that is really fascinating because. That's what's hurting a lot of these businesses.
Leighann Lovely: Middle management.
William Gilchrist: I play middle management.
Leighann Lovely: Middle management. That's the worst place to be. Get it from the top. Get it from the bottom. Squished in the middle.
William Gilchrist: Then they don't take action. They don't take it.
Leighann Lovely: No, but how do you, and that's a whole nother conversation. Okay.
William Gilchrist: actually you do something that works, even though it might not have been the most popular decision.
You do something that works. And then from there, everybody wants to take credit for it. Or they're like, you know what? We always believed in you. We, knew it. We knew when we brought you on, we knew you were the one you brought that you brought that in here and it, wow. But nobody wants to take that risk.
Leighann Lovely: Right. And so everything stays consistently stagnant.
William Gilchrist: Absolutely. People have invented roles. I mean, I've seen people, clients [00:31:00] who've dealt with large companies and like, there are people from random departments that just have invented a role in our process. Like, hey, look, I want to look at. Specifically the duration.
I'm from, I'm from the tech team. And, uh, I want to look at the specific duration of the phone call rate, like upon hang up to pick up again, to dial. I want to know specifically. And I'm like, what middle manager you're reporting to the, you need to impress because this is not a thing. Like these are metrics that no one's looking at that.
Like You really think that's going to get you a deal if we increase it by, or we decreased the rate by a half a millisecond, that's going to bring IBM in here. Do you really think that's what's going to do it? Like, you know, so a lot of these companies, I mean, I've seen it all, right? So a lot of these companies, you're just kind of like, I cannot take any of you seriously.
And of course you're not going to be able to take my proposal and sell it internally because I've seen how [00:32:00] other companies operate and it's amazing the analysis paralysis is there.
Leighann Lovely: Yeah. Yes. The, yes. Analysis paralysis is a real, real thing with, yeah, absolutely. So okay. It
William Gilchrist: gives people a job. It gives people a job.
And that's it. People who tend to veer things into analysis paralysis, it justifies their position to where they don't need to look at the reality, which is our sales happening. They can always say sales are not, or is not happening. Not because I don't understand it, or not because the product might have some gaps.
It's because the milliseconds of the call rates weren't at 1. 3, and they should be based on a blog I read at 0. 3. And if they're point eight, that will make the sales go up, you know, Leighann, I don't know if you know this, if you got really quickly and you pick up the phone again, and you dial the same number, [00:33:00] if you do it just that, much sooner, that person that didn't pick up before, probably is going to pick up the second time.
It's, it's, it's amazing. Right,
Leighann Lovely: right. It's, it's, it's awesome. It's amazing. So William, tell me when and how did you start your business? And you know, what was that vision?
William Gilchrist: Not much of a vision, more spite. Um, it was kind of
Leighann Lovely: like that answer.
William Gilchrist: Yeah. Yeah. It was out of spite. I'm, I'm a much more balanced person now, but it was, it was kind of started out of, out of anger, um, or maybe a little bit of frustration.
So it wasn't frustration at Google. I was in Google. So let me just clear that up on the podcast that it was not frustration at Google at all. When I was in Google, I had an amazing time. I worked there. I loved it. I learned so much. I call it like my MBA pretty much. Right. Yeah. Yeah. And then.
Leaving there, I went into the startup space and some of the same sales gaps that I saw in the larger companies, I was [00:34:00] seeing in the startups as well. And even as I'm seeing just patterns and some of the patterns that I've highlighted here, right. And I seen those patterns and I'm saying, okay, well, this isn't necessarily a company size issue.
This is just a sales issue. People don't know how to set up their sales systems properly. And You have different personalities that are sitting in the sales orgs and they're all usually the same type. There's the data type person. There's the, the more charismatic person who's terrible. There's CRM that, you know, there's all these different people that sit there and how do you kind of, I've seen, I've seen these consistencies.
So I was doing some work in the startup space and then I went to a company which is off my LinkedIn by the way. Um, so anybody's looking at my LinkedIn, don't worry, that company I'm about to refer to, I, they're, they're not there. , I worked for this one company that effectively just produced all the worst practices ever.
They were, they were [00:35:00] just, Their opinion of sales was you get in and three hours later a deal needs to come in Yelling at you all the time Monday morning stand up meetings at 8 a. m If you're a minute late, you are this and that and just a horrible culture really toxic place and um When I left there, I was so incredibly frustrated With not only the fact that I was seeing these gaps in the sales process, but then seeing a really, really, really bad version of it.
And keep in mind, these individuals were not necessarily successful people. They were just people who had started a business. So one thing I learned by leaving the business was, wow, you don't really have to be that smart to start a company. That, that was one of the things I got to thank them for. I was like, wow, you actually, you don't need to, I thought you had to be like this really brilliant person.
And after dealing with them, I was like, Well, you don't really need to be that bright. So all right. That's that's okay. Check. Right. Okay. I know I'm smarter than them. I'm not saying that [00:36:00] I'm the smartest person, but I know for a fact. I know for a fact I'm smarter than them. So, okay, check. I got that. And then I started to realize that, you know, a lot of it is just boldness to be able to do it.
So, out of that frustration and out of seeing just no one really understanding the sales process and seeing companies go down, seeing companies miss targets consistently, large companies, missing targets through ego, like we don't need any external advice here. We are who we are. It's like. Well, you know, I hate to say it, but like, I mean, I'm sure Netscape said the same thing in the nineties.
Right. You know, like, and, and, and this happens all the time. You see companies go under due to their own kind of ego. So I said, well, look, you know, one of the biggest problems in sales organizations is one middle management being afraid of the upper pressures, but also trying to manage the below. How about having something that is separate from the business.
It doesn't have to [00:37:00] report to the company. It just reports directly to the CEO or upper management or directly to a VP of sales or a marketing EMO, right? We have our own bylaws internally. We have our own incentives. We have everything. There's nothing that the company can do internally to sabotage the ability of the sales org.
So I kind of came up with this concept, like a sales kind of. sanctuary, like a, like a safe haven. So salespeople can be salespeople and do the work and then had to go out there and sell it. Uh, so I took my little pink logo and my weird name that's called Consig and, kept knocking on doors saying, Hey, you know, I could do some sales for you.
Leighann Lovely: And, and that's so similar to the same, you know, concept that, you know, I, I was blindsided when I was let go of my last position and in 24 hours, I had two job offers on the table. Neither one of them were a previous salary. And I went, you know what? I'll just take both of them. [00:38:00] And Ended up working as a W 2 and a contractor for another company which was able to get me where I needed to be and then all of the sudden I had a business because I was frustrated, the same as you, at how many companies as a salesperson did I walk into, they're like, okay, great, you're a salesperson, just go do your thing and sell and I went, oh, wait, okay, wait, you have no structure here.
You didn't give me like, I mean, at least give me an idea of what your contracts look like. Do you have any media? Do you have any? And then it's the same problem happens so frequently at companies of the push and pull of sales and operations. I was at, I was at a company that I flat out had operations go, we hate salespeople.
And I wanted to turn around and go, if I don't exist, you don't exist. I bring in the business, you execute on it. If my job, my role is not [00:39:00] here, you don't exist. Your job is not here. Now, I'm, I'm not one of those people.
William Gilchrist: I would just ask them why, like, if someone says that they hate salespeople, they'd be like, well, that's a very common thing.
I mean, I don't know if I like them myself. Uh, you know, like, that's a good talking point. I mean, I'm not sure if I like salespeople myself.
Leighann Lovely: But it's, why is there such a disconnect between sales and operations and why? Does marketing and sales not work together because they go hand in hand.
William Gilchrist: There's a disconnect between sales and everybody.
Because movies like Wolf of Wall Street, Glenn, Gary, Glenn Ross, people believe boiler room, like people believe that sales is just getting on a phone and then work your magic. I think it was work your magic. No. So when operations and marketing, what marketing is usually a worst scenario because marketing likes to manage the sales data, marketing that they're not being measured really by, like, so they're not [00:40:00] measured by conversions.
We're measured by conversions and they want to measure version. So it's kind of an interesting, like human shield. It's like, let's put the sales in front of us, but when it comes to operations, They get a bit of a pass. Marketers, I think, you know, for all the marketers out there, I'm going to call it out, you know, no, you guys use the shields, but for operations, they get a bit of a pass.
Cause I would say you just don't know what you're saying. It's simply that they say if an operations person or an engineer says that they don't like salespeople, I understand exactly why you feel that way, because you just have no idea what salespeople is.
Leighann Lovely: Right. And I, and I had somebody once say to me, well, you get to go out and have all the fun while I'm stuck here in the office.
And I wanted to go, do you think that it's always fun for me to be out until nine o'clock at night at networking meetings and then have to come back in here in the office by eight or nine o'clock in the morning and then to miss my daughter's event because I'm [00:41:00] out networking or I'm out like there are days that I am that are weeks that I am working 70 hours a week but you clock in At eight, and you leave at five, like
William Gilchrist: what is even worse than that?
If someone's saying that, right, ultimately, I mean, it's styles. I like to lean in. It's like, no, absolutely. I am having all the fun. I also have to carry a target every quarter. What what what was your target the last two quarters? Because if I don't deliver something
Leighann Lovely: right, I could
William Gilchrist: I could be out of here.
Leighann Lovely: That's the other thing.
William Gilchrist: What what are you measured by? You're measured by a project. So our worlds are different. I'm supposed to go out and get new revenue. Thus, I mean, I made a comment. Uh, to a friend of mine that in the last, you know, 15, 16 years, I've never not had some sales target ever in my life, ever in my life.
So [00:42:00] every birthday, everything in my whole adult life, I've always had something I needed to deliver financially for some company, even my own single quarter.
Leighann Lovely: Yeah.
William Gilchrist: And that in itself is a reality that operations wouldn't understand. That's why I said they, they don't know that. Right. Right. The sip of wine at dinner or whatever is something fun.
Yeah, it is to drown away my tears.
Leighann Lovely: To get through the fact that, Oh my gosh, I might be, you know, 50, 000 short of. The, you know, the target that I'm supposed to meet, you know, right now, anyway, we are coming to time,
William Gilchrist: which my boss threw the target out of thin air. Right, right, right. And
Leighann Lovely: by the way, you know, your, your revenue is really short this quarter.
Are you going to make that up in the next three days? Um, oh, oh, yeah, sure. Like, where did it come from again? Right. Where, when did, when did, [00:43:00] did you increase that? Oh, I just increased it three days ago. So you better get out there.
William Gilchrist: Cause we wanted it because we believe that our product is so good that I can just say, I want 10 million this year.
Right. Right.
Leighann Lovely: Right. So we're coming to time because my gosh, I, it got away from me. This has been such an amazing conversation, William, but before we wrap up, I give everybody 30 seconds for a shameless pitch. So please go ahead, and pitch away.
William Gilchrist: Absolutely. We'll check out our website, consig. com.
That's K O N S Y G. com. We are cool characters, very serious about sales. We're also very nerdy on sales as well. Um, very personable people, I guess, I guess we have to be considering our profession and, always, you know, always open to conversations, not just about our value in terms of what we do for businesses, but also any kind of.
No consultations or even just a chat. I'm always [00:44:00] open for that as well. We're pretty accessible.
Leighann Lovely: That's amazing. And your website and, LinkedIn will be on the show notes. So if somebody wants to reach out to you, they can find you there. But again, William, this has been such an amazing conversation. I truly, and I'm a nerd just like you.
I love talking about sales and, and business. And so I really appreciate your time. Thank you so much.
William Gilchrist: Thanks for having me on.
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Mastering Sales and Fulfillment

In this episode of Love Your Sales, Leighann Lovely chats with Dave Gulas, President and co-founder of EZD C3 PL, about navigating the balance between making genuine connections and avoiding common pitfalls in sales. Dave shares valuable insights on the importance of authentic communication, the efficacy of proper discovery, and how being visible and building trust online can significantly impact your success. The conversation also touches on Dave's journey from pharmaceutical distribution to leading a thriving logistics company and how his podcast, "Beyond Fulfillment," facilitates learning and growth for fellow entrepreneurs. Tune in for practical advice and inspiring stories to elevate your sales game!
Contact Dave –
LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/davegulas/
Website – davegulas.com
Book link - https://hicksalicia.gumroad.com/l/DaveGulasEZDC3PL?_gl=1*76pocx*_ga*MTQ0MjAyNTk2NC4xNzIwMzYzMzE4*_ga_6LJN6D94N6*MTcyMTY2NTAwMy43LjEuMTcyMTY2NTcwMS4wLjAuMA..
Code - WEALTH
 
Special Thank you to our Sponsors – Genhead – www.genhead.com and Sales Rescue – www.rescuemysales.com
Robb Conlon – Intro and outro – Westport Studio - https://www.westportstudiosllc.com/
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 Channel Subscribe link - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-O7W9DzaRv4waodQKCprIg?sub_confirmation=1
 
Leighann Lovely: Welcome to another episode of Love Your Sales. I am so excited that I am joined by Dave Gulas. He is the President and Co-founder of EZD C3 PL and the host of Beyond Fulfillment Podcast. I am so thrilled to have you join me today. Dave, welcome to the show. Hey, it's great to be here, Leighann. Thank you. Yeah, so why don't we jump right in, tell us a little bit about who you are, what you do, and then we can, you [00:02:00] know.
Talk about sales. Yeah, absolutely. So I'm president and Co-founder of EZDC 3PL. Uh, we've been around just about two years now and we help, e commerce brands with warehousing, fulfillment, and transportation. So, you know, think for people to sell online or have a Shopify store and they want to outsource, , their logistics, their fulfillment, so they'll rent space in our warehouse and we provide that.
Dave Gulas: Pick, pack and ship their orders. We connect to their store. We handle all aspects of their, uh, their fulfillment.
Leighann Lovely: That's awesome. And it's, it's so funny that you, you know, when you explain that so precisely and simply, I have a couple of people I can probably introduce you to, which, you know, it's when somebody brings, you know, Really simplistically, and I think that as founders as salespeople, sometimes we get stuck in our own heads, but, it's a very simple like this is what you do.
And, um, it reminds [00:03:00] me of, of the people who are like, Oh, I have this problem. Right. And it's like, Oh yeah, I, I know a couple of people who are having that exact problem right now. So tell me a little bit about, you know, some of your, you know, ideal clients, exactly, you know, the size of those clients and, and what are the problems they have when they come to you?
Dave Gulas: So generally when so think of a company starting to sell online, oftentimes these companies, if, you know, particularly if they're bootstrapped, they'll begin fulfilling out of either a small warehouse, or even maybe out of their, their home per se, and they'll grow the business that way. But every company reaches a point where, okay, in order to continue to scale, they need to outsource the logistics because as they begin to grow and scale, they have thousands of orders going out in a month.
And, you know, they're dealing with the complexity of, you know, managing a warehouse and managing staff and negotiating their parcel rates. And. [00:04:00] You know, software, um, becomes an issue and all these different things that are, are crucial to, the logistics of a company that's growing, they all reach a point where it makes sense to outsource that to a company that specializes on the logistics where they can then focus on, uh, the other, the other things that they do well to continue to grow their business, whether it's product development, sales, marketing, or, or other aspects of their business.
Um, you know, according to a national survey, and the number one reason is lack of communication. And that's Big reason why we started the company a couple of years ago, because we came across numerous exam, numerous examples of people that were with the 3PL. They were selling online and because maybe they weren't, uh, at a particular package volume or a particular order threshold, they just were, they were not given priority and they were, they just weren't getting good service.
So it would, you know, orders wouldn't go out. It would be days with no response. Customers were upset and they were, they were just really getting second class service. [00:05:00] And our. Our team's background is in generic pharmaceutical distribution, and we have about 20 years experience doing that, and so that, that in itself is a very, uh, high, high touch, high customer service type of environment where everything's urgent, everything's going overnight, things go wrong all the time, you're dealing with small business owners as your customers, so you have to constantly be in touch and make sure that That, they're taking care of.
So we thought our brand of customer service would do well within the 3PL space. And that, that's why we, uh, we got into it.
Leighann Lovely: So it's, funny that you say, you know, number one reason that customers are not happy is communication. And I think that's the number one reason in any industry, um, you know, a salesperson goes.
goes out, makes that sale. They're making the promises as a salesperson does is that our team can do this. Our team are, you know, fulfillment team, whether that be in an, in a warehousing team, whether that be in your space, the, you know, the commerce [00:06:00] side, the e commerce side of, well, that's not your space, but you know what I mean?
Um, what, whatever space that might be in is the salesperson goes out. Sells that makes those promises and then crickets because there's that handoff between. This person selling and the person who's going to deliver on the promise that the salesperson made. Right.
Dave Gulas: Yeah. Yeah, of course. That's a, um, that's a critical piece of the puzzle, , to where, you know, like you said, right, the salesperson that they're, selling the, you know, the vision of.
You know, these problems solved and they're counting on their team to execute. And if that doesn't happen, that that's a big problem.
Leighann Lovely: Right. And I think that a lot of companies, um, I don't want to say fall short, but there is a disconnect sometimes when it comes to what is the salesperson out there representing?
Do they know their company? Do they understand the logistics of [00:07:00] how their company works so that they can sell the product properly, not over promise. I hate when people say, you know, under promise, over deliver. How about just promise what you're going to deliver?
Dave Gulas: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Because the, the, the worst thing you can do is over promise and under deliver.
And we see that Time and time and time again. Uh, and that, that doesn't help anybody.
Leighann Lovely: Absolutely. So, you know, help me, um, understand, you know, let's kind of, let's go back a little bit, help me better understand like your journey, where did you come from? When and why, and I say this in a very kind and loving way, being a, you know, a co founder myself.
Why did you decide that? Yep. I'm going to start a business. I'm going to take the leap. I'm going to, you know, this is the journey. Um, and how did you go about [00:08:00] starting this business?
Dave Gulas: Yeah. So I had, , so I've been in sales my whole career and, the bulk of it was, uh, with a pharmaceutical distributor where I started an entry level sales and worked my way up to executive level and was there for a long time.
And they ultimately went under. And that was a couple of years back. And when that happened, uh, a good friend of mine from the industry that owned like a friendly competitor, , we just connected and we had this idea where, you know, he had excess space available in Kentucky and we saw an opportunity with this other vertical within 3PL logistics and everything lined up and we just decided to do it.
And so, yeah, that's, that's how it started. And, uh, yeah, it's been, it's been a journey, you know, ever since too, just in terms of , you know, the, the industry I came from was very niche and it was very traditional sales with, um, you know, calling a lot of phone sales and calling and commodity based type, distribution sales versus on the founder [00:09:00] journey.
I quickly realized within logistics that you. Um, you have to be visible online to where people can find you because so often in our industry, you don't know where the business is going to come from and timing is everything. So, , as soon as I got out there and I, I realized kind of how, how business was done within logistics, uh, you know, I quickly had to start building a personal brand and selling in a completely different way.
Leighann Lovely: So explain that to me. Um, You know, because often, you know, and I've, I've dabbled in industries far and wide, um, everything from selling advertising space and print media to, you know, selling and, you know, in, in industries where timing was. I mean, you live and die on timing, you know, renewals on insurance and that kind of thing to the, you know, to industries where it's a, you know, you just call in and it doesn't matter [00:10:00] the timing.
It's more of, you know, just the need at that moment kind of thing. So explain to me a little bit more about, you know, timing and what that meant to, you know, what it means to get. you know, out there and social and make yourself visible and how you started to learn that and how to position yourself.
Dave Gulas: Yes.
So, , yeah, within logistics, right. When you think about our customers, uh, they're coming to us and they're, they're moving into our warehouse, right. And they're sending us their goods and we sign an agreement. And, you know, the standard agreement is 12 months and an auto renews and, you know, whatnot. So it's not like a short term thing.
So it's a big commitment. So it's not a decision they take likely, lightly. And it's not something definitely, ideally, it's not something that an e commerce company is going to want to do very often in terms of move warehouses. So it's a big decision and it doesn't happen [00:11:00] overnight. uh, you know, versus the, the, the industry I came from was very transactional.
I mean, these, these pharmacies, they're buying medicine every single day from a variety of people, right? So it was a very transactional commodity based sale where this is much more of a lot of more work is done before you sign an agreement. And then the relationship begins and, you know, you want to do the best possible job.
So they stay with you long term. So that's, that's the business. You know, like and trust, um, is, is so critical to establish and oftentimes too, they might not even know who you are and it's, it's not the type of thing where you're going to be cold calling all the time for, for people that need to find a new warehouse.
They oftentimes are going to come to you. So, you know, I wasn't, when I, we started this, I was, Basically invisible online. So I had to get out there on LinkedIn and start posting a lot, start learning about content and providing value, uh, through the content and, you know, then of course, doing the self promotion type of thing.
[00:12:00] And yeah, I, I just, I, I got with a boutique firm that was, you know, had a lot of experience in doing that and just started collaborating with them and learned as I went and. Yeah, I wasn't afraid to take action, start doing it and, uh, you know, get better as I went.
Leighann Lovely: That's awesome. And so when people come to you, I'm, I'm going to, well, one, I'm going to make the assumption that you're beyond fulfillment podcast is something that, gets you out there that really, you know, helps from a social media standpoint really is helping you kind of increase your visibility.
Dave Gulas: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. So the podcast came about as a result of, you know, on the founder journey, right. Learned so much. It wasn't what I thought it was. Uh, Made a ton of mistakes, had to course correct constantly. And the, the main theme that I continue to notice is that the biggest source of learning I [00:13:00] would get is from other founders that I would speak to on this journey and kind of learning the challenges they went through, how they handled or solve these problems and whatnot.
And then one day the idea just hit me is like, wow, if you started a podcast, you could put these conversations on a public forum. The audience could benefit, the guests would benefit. It would, it would give you exposure as well. So it would really be a win win. And, you know, kind of same thing. It seemed like a good idea.
I checked with my team. We came up a way with a way to start it quickly and, and, uh, you know, from where we were. And so I said, okay, great. Let's do it.
 So yeah, that's how the podcast started. And, um, yeah, everything lined up. So we just started doing it and same thing. I just, found a way to be consistent with that. And yeah, we've published now been doing it just about a year.
We've published like 72 episodes or so, and. , yeah,
Leighann Lovely: it is same with, with me for obviously this podcast, one of the greatest ways to create a community to learn from [00:14:00] to, um, not only learn from, but to also help others learn from and to, you know, what a great way to get a captive audience, right, Dave? I mean, now I'm, I've got a captive audience here where I can pick your brain, educate myself.
At the same time, try to educate others and get the word out. And that's the same reason that I started my first, my very first podcast ever was to, you know, when you get the same question over and over from, for instance, clients, that was the reason I started my first podcast. Now I've moved on from that one.
And, but, and I've heard a lot of people say that, well, It's a great way to learn. It's a great way to figure out how to avoid mistakes if at all possible as a founder or co founder. But that's, that's awesome. It's also a great way to, you know, start to brand yourself, um, not only as a business, [00:15:00] but also as a business.
as an individual who has something to offer to the world?
Dave Gulas: Yeah. Yeah. A hundred percent. And, um, as soon as we started the podcast, that was a big inflection point for our business where we noticed a big uptick in conversion. And then also just, it was a great source of lead generation. And, uh, you know, I always attribute it to, you know, like the like, and trust to where if you think about a brand, right.
Oftentimes for these, these e commerce brands, they're Their inventory is their livelihood. So they really have to trust you before they're going to ship that all to you for you to take care of. And so many companies in our space operate as faceless, nameless brands. So just even the fact that getting out there continually on video and posting every week, uh, you know, new episodes and interviewing all these experts from not only our industry, but all different types of entrepreneurs.
Uh, it's, it's just it's helped immensely with, our marketing and, and with the business.
Leighann Lovely: [00:16:00] Right. That's, that's amazing. So let's, let's talk about the things as a salesperson as, you know, as a, um, a new business as a, even for a, an entrepreneur, a, a brand new salesperson. Let's, let's, let's hone in on, What not to do the wrong way to do it.
The, you know, why people buy and you mentioned, you know, the no, no, like, and trust, right? The, the, like, and trust the, let's, let's talk about, you know, some of your experience in that. And, you know, and I, I mean, I could go on all day long about. Don't, don't message me on LinkedIn about how, you know, you love my profile.
You'd love to, you know, you'd love to connect. And then as soon as we do connect a three long page message about how you want to sell me your product.
Dave Gulas: Yeah. I got like two of those this morning. I mean, I get them like all the time. Right. Constantly. Right. Um, yeah. And it's [00:17:00] funny too. I'll just mention this.
This is a special gift to your listeners. So after my first year as a founder, , and publicly grow in the business and posting and promoting everywhere, right. I was just inundated with sales attempts. So I just was in a creative mode last year and, uh, I wrote an ebook, which is called the five beds, the five bed.
Sales habits that are killing your deals and how to fix them. And, I'll see, you can post the link and then if it's on gum road, and if you put the coupon code wealth in there, you can get the book for free. But what it is, it was, I just took five examples of like the worst sales pitches I had received as a founder.
why they were so bad and then what you should do instead. Um, so it's, it's just, you know, some, you know, no names or anything in there, but just some, some stories that I'm sure others that can relate to. But just to give you a couple, like one. That I see constantly is like salespeople being so aggressive and pushy and it's like they're trying to make the [00:18:00] sale just to make the sale with really being oblivious to, is this even the right fit or does this even benefit the person I'm selling to?
Leighann Lovely: You know, absolutely. Have you ever had anybody try to sell you your own product, like something that you actually yourself sell? Because I get that all the time. People are like, Oh, I see that you blah, blah, blah. We say, you know, we do blah, blah. And I'm like, yeah, if you look at my website. I actually do that as well.
I mean, and, and again, you know, more power to you for getting yourself out there. Don't try to immediately say, Hey, this is, it'll cost you this much to buy this from me. When you have no idea who you are reaching out to. Like, why are you trying to sell me something if you don't have any clue as to [00:19:00] who I am?
Like, and I can understand, like, if it's a marketing campaign from, like, a CRM company, great, that's how they brand themselves. But if you are an individual salesperson just sending out a mass campaign of, hey, come and talk to me, I'm never going to talk to you. Never. Like, you're going to go on my spam list.
Because you, you have no clue as to who I am and what I do. And I probably in my own network, no, like eight people who do that same thing.
Dave Gulas: Yeah. And like, I'm fine with. Everyone prospects and cold calls and does all that thing, but it's just really the approach, like I always look at it more and again, our businesses may be different than other industries, but still like ours is all about discovery.
So before we even get to a presentation or even like a, like this would be a good fit, we want to. learn [00:20:00] about the prospect and what their challenges are and what their business is and how we would potentially benefit them before, even recommending a solution. Right. And yeah, that's, and, my friend, Darren Jacklin, he has a saying, uh, he's a speaker and whatnot, but he says, and he compares it to the medical industry too, but he says prescription without diagnosis, Is malpractice literally in the medical industry, it's malpractice.
But yet you see that everywhere in sales where people are trying to prescribe their product without even a proper diagnosis of, is this even the right fit? So that, that's what I would say is the biggest issue I see is people need to take more time and. more of a discovery, uh, approach with prospecting before trying to hammer close something that doesn't even, make sense.
Leighann Lovely: Right. If you only have extra large pants, you're not going to be able to sell those to a size zero person. It would it make sense?
Dave Gulas: [00:21:00] That's a great example
Leighann Lovely: here. Here. I have a pair of pants. They're perfect for you. Buy them, buy them, buy them what it doesn't fit everybody. It just doesn't. And same with the reverse.
If you have an extra small and you have a person who is a large, why would you say. Buy these, it's, I mean, it, it, if you, if the person doesn't fit your product, you are better off to refer them to somebody else and hope that that person remembers that you did right by them one day and have them refer back to you.
And if you truly make a connection with that person and you should be as a salesperson truly sitting down, going through that discovery, making, and you shouldn't not in all cases. I, let me, let me. Retract that comment. Not everybody likes everybody. Not everybody makes a connection with everybody, but for the majority of the people that you sit [00:22:00] down with and do a discovery, you, there should be some form of like mutual, like understanding.
And at the end of that, if you don't have a product that matches their need, I I'm the kind of person who's like, you know what, I actually know somebody that you would probably benefit better working with. And people appreciate that. I will remember that person for referring me to somebody else who can help me.
more than them trying to shove their solution down my throat and walking away with a bad taste in my mouth.
Dave Gulas: Yeah. And too, right. To, to your point, like the, the person on the other end, if it's not the right fit, they know that, or if, if it's going to become apparent very quickly. So nothing good is going to come from, you know, trying to place a square peg in a round hole per se.
Leighann Lovely: Right. Both parties [00:23:00] will end up. Not feeling happy.
Dave Gulas: Yeah,
Leighann Lovely: it may not be in a week. It may not be in a month. It may be in 6 months or a year. And if it's that far down the road, that bad taste is going to be even worse because now there's going to be. Money involved, there's going to be, you know, it's going to be a lot worse and potentially damaging reviews.
So it's, you're so much better off than cutting that person loose and moving on, then again, trying to make a, you know, a pitch to somebody that just doesn't make sense.
Dave Gulas: Yeah, a hundred percent. 100%.
Leighann Lovely: So tell me a little bit more about this book. I'd love it. Do you remember another example?
Dave Gulas: Yeah. Well, so speaking of making connections and networking, [00:24:00] another one that I go into too, and it's, um, like a similar point is I've had, you know, cause part of being a founder and as you know, you're networking constantly and you're meeting people over zoom and, or if it's in person or whatever.
So constantly having conversations, What do you do? This is what I do. What do you do? Okay, maybe it makes sense to do something together. Maybe we could work together in this way. Maybe I know someone, right? That's, that's how I always try to approach it is me, you know, or just, just learning or making a connection.
 And it's fun. Like I've had this happen several times and usually with consultants for whatever reason, is we get on a call and they're trying to. You know, turn it into a, like a sales call, like on the net, like we just, we just met, we just connected and you're, you know, and, you're already asking those big picture vision questions and, you know, where do you see yourself in five years?
Leighann Lovely: So [00:25:00] my, a friend of mine calls that, pitch slapping, um, which I love, but it, you know, it's, it's like a bad date and I'm literally quoting him. Um, then saying he's been on my podcast, but it's like a bad date where you sit down or you're on a zoom call and all of the sudden you're like, oh man, I really wish somebody would call me with an emergency right now.
Cause I don't want to have to sit here. And listen to this person basically pitch me and they're like, and try to sell me like I'm not doing a one on one so that I can like be sold.
Dave Gulas: Yeah.
Leighann Lovely: And, there have been multiple times where. I've tried to help people, like I'll literally get into that meeting and I'll go, wait, okay, wait, like, are you new to networking?
Like, like, is this, is this new for you? And they'll go, Oh yeah, yeah. I just started [00:26:00] doing this. And I'm like, how do I nicely tell them like, This is not how you do it without insulting them, right? But I, I want to always be a helper. I also don't want to insult somebody, hurt their feelings and be like, yeah, you're doing this wrong.
Because you never know the kind of person that, you know, are they a person who will accept, you know, feedback? Are they not? And again, some people are very open to it. Like, yeah, tell me what I'm doing wrong. Like, because I'm not, it doesn't seem to be working. But yeah, that is, that is definitely, that's an annoying one.
Dave Gulas: Yeah. Another one too, is the, the like, like rapport building, right? Like if you think about even traditional, uh, cause people try that too. Someone just did that the other day where like, I don't know who they are and never talked to them. They just happen to call me and I don't get many cold calls [00:27:00] anymore.
Uh, you know, cause the way our industry is set up to it's, you know, it's typically scheduled calls, but someone cold called me out of the blue and He said, Oh, hi Dave. How are you? And you know, it's just just add like they were trying to make friendly small talk and I was like, who they didn't even introduce themselves.
Right. And I'm like, yeah, who is this? And what do you want?
Leighann Lovely: It can get creepy. Like, I've had people actually, like, call me and start dropping personal stuff about me. And I'm like, I don't know who you, and that's because of how social I am because of how much, you know, you're out there, Dave, you, you have a podcast, you're out there talking about yourself, maybe dropping in personal tidbits about yourself.
And then all of a sudden you don't realize somebody calls you and they're like, Oh, you know, how is your daughter or how? And I'm like. Wait, do I, do we know this person? Like they literally stalk you to learn [00:28:00] personal information about you that crosses a line and you're like, oh my gosh, how does this person know this?
And you have to remember like, oh, because I post on LinkedIn, I post on Facebook, I have a podcast where sometimes I talk about myself and you have to actually take a step back and go, wow, this person like creepy sales. Stalking sales, like, and then you just get this icky feeling like, yeah, I'm not interested.
Like go stalk somebody else.
Dave Gulas: Yeah. And I've seen that as a strategy taught by some people, uh, where, you know what I mean? You look at the personal stuff, but there's a way to do it. And there's a, like, I always just like. Describe it as just being authentic, like the same way you would communicate with a friend.
That's how your sales call should be in terms of tone and speed and conversation. And I always like to just lead with value. And I'm more of a [00:29:00] driver type personality, right? Where I'm to the point, but at the same time, right? You want it to be friendly, conversational, but meaningful. And if you just be your authentic self, instead of trying to be fake with the small talk, like Rick rapport is not fake small talk.
I look at rapport is meeting people where they're at and how do they like to communicate? What, what are the challenges they facing? What value can you offer? Where does it really make sense if you're thinking about what's best for them? And if it doesn't, then recognize that and move on.
Leighann Lovely: Right. That that's great advice.
And meeting people where they're at. And, and that's very, you know, I am, I have always loved cold calling. It's part of the reason that I started the business that I, you know, that I have today is, you know, cold calling is just something that, you know, you're, I look at it as, I'm just simply making a quick phone call to see if somebody is interested in my product.
Hey, I'm Leighann. I'm calling, you know, I I'm Leighann. Hi, Dave. How you doing today? Look, I just wanted to give [00:30:00] you a quick call, whatever it might be. Is there some interest here? Can I provide you with some, you know, value, blah, blah, blah. But, and I don't have the time to go and stalk you before I make that phone call.
But what I do make sure that I do is that every time. You and I have a conversation have an interaction is that I make a notation of what that conversation was about. And I build the rapport authentically based on interaction between us. I don't go and stock whether or not you have a dog or a daughter or, you know, A boat that you go out on and all that kind of stuff, because then it becomes kind of strange and creepy.
Some people, some states are really huge into their college that they went to that, you know, if you have something in common that you notice. That's okay, but getting into like the weird stuff kind of [00:31:00] gets,
but go ahead.
Dave Gulas: No, no, that you're good.
Leighann Lovely: So we are coming to time and I give everybody at the end of, you know, at the end of the show, their 32nd shameless pitch. I'd like to offer that to you.
Dave Gulas: Okay, sure, sure. Yeah, so EZDC3PL, we help manufacturers and e commerce brands with warehousing, fulfillment, and transportation.
So, if you are selling online and you're doing fulfillment yourself and it's a headache, you might want to talk to us and find out what we offer to see if it could be a fit. Or if you're with a 3PL currently and you're not happy, which we talk to people like that all the time. Again, we're, we're headquartered in Kentucky, so right in the, the center of the country, basically.
So, yeah, if you, if you have, , if you have a need in that area, By all means, come talk to us. And if you're looking to hear inspiring stories from entrepreneurs with challenges they faced and pivots they had to make and how they overcame the hurdles within their business, so you can take those same ideas and apply it to what you're doing, [00:32:00] check out the beyond fulfillment podcast.
We publish everywhere that you can find a podcast and, uh, on YouTube as well.
Leighann Lovely: Awesome. And if somebody wanted to reach out to you, how could they go about doing that? What is the best way?
Dave Gulas: LinkedIn. I'm always on LinkedIn, so that's a great way. Or you can go to dave gulas.com and that has the links to everything that I do.
Leighann Lovely: Awesome. And those will be included in the show notes, along with a link to your ebook and the code that you provided to us. I really appreciate you coming on today, Dave. This has been an awesome conversation.
Dave Gulas: Yeah, excellent. Thanks so much, Leighann.
 

Unlocking Sales Success with SEO: Featuring Eric Vallee

Ready to unlock the secrets to amplifying your sales through unbeatable SEO strategies? In this episode of "Love Your Sales," host Leighann Lovely sits down with SEO expert Eric Vallee to dive deep into the world of search engine optimization. Discover how Eric catapulted companies like M3 and DuPont to new revenue heights by mastering the art and science of SEO. Learn the three pillars of website optimization and why constant content updates are crucial for sustained success. Explore the importance of brand recognition, immediate response to leads, and how integrating sales and digital marketing can create a powerful synergy for your business. Tune in and transform your approach to find, attract, and engage clients in our digital-first world!
Contact Eric
Website -  www.silverfoxmke.com 
LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/eric-m-vallee/ 
 
Special Thank you to our Sponsors – Genhead – www.genhead.com and Sales Rescue – www.rescuemysales.com
Robb Conlon – Intro and outro – Westport Studio - https://www.westportstudiosllc.com/
The Brave Ones – Instrumental Version Song by Jan Sanejko - https://artlist.io/royalty-free-music/song/the-brave-ones/119489
 
#sales #businessdevelopment #entrepreneur #entrepreneurship #selling #relashionships #customerexperience #podcast #loveyoursales #lastingrelashionships #salescareers #salesmanager #salesdevelopment #traininganddevelopment #leadershipdevelopment #salespodcast #salestraining
 
Welcome to another episode of Love Your Sales. I am extremely excited because I am joined by Eric Vallee. Eric is an expert [00:01:00] in generating leads and revenue from websites. During his past 15 years, he has specialized in search engine optimization and recently launched his own SEO consulting firm, silver Fox M K E during this time, he has worked with numerous companies, including M three and, and DuPont to help generate leads and revenue during the last, his last position as a digital marketing manager.
For a plastic and adhesive manufacturing. He oversaw all aspects of the website, as well as partnering with the sales team to drive and close sales. He consistently generated more than 2000 leads each year. Uh, he also helped bring in more than 1 million in revenue , from new customers each year. That is absolutely awesome.
Eric, I am so thrilled to have you join me today and talk about. Well, how SEO can you know, really how important SEO is. [00:02:00] So welcome to the show. 
Eric Vallee: Yeah. Thanks for having me on. I'm very excited. I've, uh, I've been listening to your podcast for a while and I, I think it's a great podcast. I've worked with, I've had the opportunity to work with many sales people and I find some of the.
Insights that your podcast provides to be just exceptional. 
Well, thank you. That's, that's a huge compliment. And I, um, you know, I love working with, salespeople have to be able to rely on a lot of, a lot of tools, right. Or we should be. And if, and if you're a salesperson out there not relying on all of the tools that are available to you, you need to really, you know, take a look around and, and lean into those.
And one of those. Being somebody like yourself, um, because we live in a digital world, , but that digital world is only as good as the, as the people who are actually helping behind the scenes make. You know, us visible, right? And that's what, 
Eric Vallee: yeah, 
that's [00:03:00] what SEO is. 
Eric Vallee: Yeah. SEO. So basically just to give a primer on SEO, SEO is basically it's part art, part science, a lot of experience in what you're trying to accomplish is you're trying to an SEO specialist, their goal is to understand how search engines like Google and Google is the big player.
How they. Analyze and look at websites so that you can, by understanding how Google looks at a website, you can understand and help businesses become more visible on, Google and Bing is also important. A lot of people discount Bing. Google has somewhere around 70 percent of the market, but Bing actually has about 18%.
They also have Yahoo that goes in there. But the big thing that's really important with Bing is that, uh, GPT 4, the AI is actually pulling from Bing. So as [00:04:00] that continues, Bing is going to become more and more important, but getting back to SEO, what SEO is really is looking at a website. Understanding what it does well and how it could be improved to get better visibility on.
Interesting. I, I did not know that about Bing, , and I'm sure that that's common knowledge in, in your, um, in your circle. So, so explain to me what, you know, SEO, you explained what it is, but how does one even begin to. Better understand what's happening when you say, I'm going to improve your SEO. Okay.
Well, what, what does that mean? Like, what are you, what are you doing? 
Eric Vallee: Absolutely. That's an excellent question. So basically when somebody like me, like a consultant comes in and looks at a website, I'll look at a variety of factors. The first thing I always look at is I'll try to get an estimate of how their organic traffic is performing.[00:05:00] 
And let me go back a little bit on what organic traffic is. A website gets. Visitors from four different sources. One is direct traffic. If you give somebody your business card, it's got your website on it. They type that domain into a website that's considered direct traffic. They're on, say if somebody's on this podcast and you have a link on it, that's called referral traffic and websites will get referral traffic, or like if they're listed on Yelp.
They would, and somebody goes on Yelp and, and then clicks over their website. That's referral traffic. The other source is paid. So like, if you do what's called pay per click or paid advertising, that's another source. The fourth is organic and it's called organic because. When Google looks at your website and they put things in results, they consider organically how the website comes into their search engine results page.
[00:06:00] So they call it organic traffic because of that. But it's basically traffic from search engines. So. Those are the four types. So when I look at a website, what I do first is I want to see how much organic traffic, because those other ones are important, but I can't have as much of an impact on them as I can on search engine traffic or organic traffic.
So I look to see how well somebody's doing in organic traffic. I will typically Make that as a benchmark against how they're doing with some of their closest competitors. So if I looked at a website, uh, say, , your website for rescue my sales, I might look at it and try to ask, what are some of the, give me two or three of your competitors that you regularly see in the marketplace.
And then I would look at their website to determine how well they're doing. For instance, if you're getting, uh, a hundred visits a month, you might feel very good with that. But if I tell you that your closest competitors are both getting well over a thousand visits [00:07:00] a month, then you're not going to feel so good about it.
Right. So 
Eric Vallee: the first place we look at is that then we start to look at some of the reasons why you're doing either well, or you could do better. And so. What a search engine specialist will do is they'll look at how does a website perform in on page, which means how much content do you have? Is the content driving the type of traffic that you want?
And so let me, you know, I'm following. So when you do this analysis, when you're, when you're sitting and I'm trying to get in your head now, when you're sitting here doing this analysis, you're, you're, you know, figuring out, you know, where these are coming from. Um, and then you're going to, you're going to try to optimize this.
I'm assuming there's different places in the background where you can put keywords, but I'm going to guess also that it's the language on [00:08:00] the actual website as well. 
Eric Vallee: It is. Absolutely. So, so really, with with search engine optimization, there's three pillars. There's on page. , there's technical and then there's off page.
On page is anything like it describes on page, so like if I look at the content that you have, how is it written? Is it written to appeal to the audience that you're trying to target? That's where the keywords come in. And if you have keywords, how well is it aligned with those keywords that you're trying to target?
Okay, 
Eric Vallee: off page is links. So what. What Google, when they first came out, when Sergei and Brin first created Google, back in the time when they were doing it, you could, the search engines that were around were like Ask Jeeves, things like that. You could actually buy your way to the top of an organic ranking.
You could give them money, and they would put you at the top. Sergei and Brin said, that's not how we [00:09:00] want to do it. We want the World Wide Web to make this happen. The decisions. So when somebody gives you a link when they take a hyperlink from their web page to your website, that's basically a referral.
It's that that website saying, I recommend going to this. This is a good source. So Off page is basically how many links you get from other websites and how good they are. For example, if you get a, if you get a link from an education, a website that ends in edu, extremely valuable. If you get a website from a org, very valuable.
If you get a website from a com, Could be valuable, might not be. It depends how good it is for your site and how related to it. The whole aspect of it. I don't want to get too much into the details of it, but 
this is, I mean, this is now that you're like, you're explaining it in, in layman's term, right? This is no, [00:10:00] no different than.
Being out in a networking at a networking meeting, for instance. 
Eric Vallee: Absolutely. 
I mean, this is like sales 101. They created, they created it so that. The better you are, you know, I shouldn't say, well, yeah, it's like a popularity contest almost with, value with the five star review. Right.
I'm not going to get a referral from Eric. Um, if I'm not, if I haven't proven that I am a good. Or that I'm good at what I do in my business. 
Eric Vallee: Yes, exactly. It's the same 
thing, like, so if a org refers me, which, you know, we can, we could equate this to, you know, somebody who's really high or highly respected in, you know, in a networking group says, Oh, you should go to Leanne for that.
That may hold more weight than if somebody who's, you know, brand new, never used me, [00:11:00] barely knows me says, Oh, you should go talk. Wildly interesting. 
Eric Vallee: Well, and the thing is that a lot of people don't understand is that, so with dot orgs and dot edus, you can't just have those. So there's a, there's a whole organization that oversees things.
And when you go to like a GoDaddy or any type to buy a domain, you They won't let you buy a dot edu domain unless you have the accreditation. So that's why those are so valuable. So like I, I graduated from the university of Milwaukee. If I was able to get a link from a UW Milwaukee dot edu, Google knows that those are very limited.
And so they're so much more valuable. So like you, you did it, you did have a very good analogy. Link building in a way is like a popularity contest. The more links that you get, the better your site is going to be. However, it does get a little bit more complex because it's not just the matter of the number of links.
It's also the quality of link 
[00:12:00] quality, right? Which means that you can't just go and buy. You know, link, how would I say that? No, 
Eric Vallee: you're, you're absolutely right. There's, there's a lot of, there's a lot of problems when you try to buy links. Google does not want people to buy links. So yeah, so you can't just buy your way to the top.
And the thing is, is if, say if you do something that gives you a ton of links overnight, Google will usually spot that, flag it and manually review your site. Right. Right. Right. Uh, the third, I did want to go back. So the first two areas that I mentioned were one was on site on page. The other is bought page.
The third is technical. So technical is how well your site performs. Google is very easy. Very, uh, concerned about mobile websites and how on the phone, because I know most people will access websites from their phone. So they're always looking to see how quickly your website loads on a phone. And you've done this where you load, you're at a, you know, [00:13:00] maybe you're at a basketball game or you're at a party and you look, you open your phone, you open a browser and you click on a link and the browser loads.
The website doesn't load. The first thing you do is you click back. Cause you're like, well, this website's broke. Yeah. Google knows that they want most websites to load within three seconds. And what that means is it actually, they have different terms for it, but basically that you can actually see that it's loading.
If it, if you get like a webpage on a mobile browser on a phone and it doesn't load within three seconds, where you're getting nothing, 99 percent of the people are going to just break the website. Click back and Google knows that. So what they look at is that they want your technical aspects of your website to be in tip top shape so that on a mobile phone, it loads quickly.
And that is of utmost importance for Google. 
Interesting. So, and I love, so we was literally, Google was built, on sales, on a [00:14:00] sales model. Possibly. Yeah. I mean, and that's, that's everything that you're saying is kind of what I'm hearing is that you can't, I mean, yes, you can, pay to, they have paid advertising there, which Yeah.
They've got to make money. Right. You, that's great. But on an organic level, really the only way to the top is to have the proper, almost like networking is to, is to have all the proper keywords in there is to have all the prop saying the right thing, singing the right song. And that's the same thing when you go to a networking meeting.
Eric Vallee: It's like Zig Ziglar. Everybody knows Zig Ziglar. Yeah. He's written a lot of books, very good in sales. If you get a link from a website that is associated with Zig Ziglar's organization, people are going to recognize it right away. Right. Google's going to recognize it. So it is, you're saying the [00:15:00] exact right thing.
It's, how you network, how you build your brand. And that's how valuable links are. When you have a very valuable brand like Zig Ziglar. It's going to be very valuable for those links to get that so that that's so basically what I do is I'll look at all of those aspects of a website to try to figure out whether or not somebody can do better and how they can do better because one of the things that I've seen in the course of my career doing SEO.
Organic traffic or traffic from search engines for most websites is about 40 to 60 percent of their traffic. So it's usually the lion's share of their traffic is coming in from organic. And so it's very important to try to make sure that they're maximizing that, traffic. 
Right. And having as a salesperson, if I could spend.
Less time making phone calls because every salesperson out there is like, yeah, I'd love to make, you know, have less time [00:16:00] making phone calls and more leads actually landing on my lap. That would be app. That would be amazing, which is why, you know, all of, you know, people are like, well, everybody knows target.
They don't have to advertise. Um, wait, I'm sorry. Does every single. Like, I get hit all the time by the big box stores, by all of the big name companies. Never stop marketing. Never. They never, they're known by everybody, but they never stop marketing. 
Eric Vallee: Well and that's, that kind of goes, so like I did lead scoring for four years in my last job and in the previous job I worked on, I, I helped out a lot with inside sales and one of the.
One of the rules that I have with leads is when leads come in, the first rule that I have is you've got to get on them quick. Oh, and the second rule, which is kind of where we're going with this. keep on marketing [00:17:00] is when you look at hunters and you look at hunters and farmers. There's two type of sales people that I'm aware of.
Um, hunters who generally will cultivate and do a really good job of cultivating their existing clients. And then there's hunters, hunters who want to always try to find that next deal. They're both valuable for organizations, but they're different types of People, organic search and website leads can help both of them.
And one of the reasons with hunters that it's really critical is when you talk about like big box, you said like target. If you see, if you go on a, uh, on Google and you type in, I'm looking for, Anything like golf clubs or tennis shoes or whatever. If you see target come up because you have a good experience with them, you're more likely to click on that.
And so that's how farmers can be. Can benefit from organic traffic. Because what [00:18:00] happens is a lot of people are like, well, companies know about us. We've got them. We signed a contract and , they've got my number. I can tell you from experience, a lot of existing customers will go into Google.
They'll say, if they're looking for tennis shoes, they'll look for tennis shoes. And then all of a sudden they'll see their company that they work with come up. They'll click on that link and they'll fill out a contact form rather than working with their salesperson. And we see that regularly. So brand recognition is always important.
And like you, like you said, Leanne, you want to always be marketing. 
It's the number one mistake that I see companies make is while we're doing really well, um, we're getting in a ton of business, let's pull a little bit of the budget from marketing and you know, like, because we're doing really well and I'm like, you're doing really well because you're marketing.
And if you stop, it's the [00:19:00] same thing with the salesperson. I, it's like the 30 day rule. You're making a ton of calls. You're making, you're going out there, you're knocking on doors, you're getting all this business in. And then all of a sudden you, you get really busy, you're now managing your clients that you just brought in.
And. You're not making all those phone calls and you're letting 
Eric Vallee: the, you're letting the funnel go. Right. Your, your, 
your funnel is starting to go down. And, and again, this is something that every salesperson struggles with a little bit because you do, you have, you get pulled into, you know, now managing the clients that you just signed.
And so there's, there's always that push and pull depending on, you know, your role. If you, if you eat what you kill. You're going to be in a constant cycle of up and down and up and down and up and down. Um, you know, if you're in a sales role where you literally, you sign that client, you bring them in, you kick them to a, you know, a team that's now going to, you know, manage them.
You should stay, you know, fairly steady. If you're making the calls.
Eric Vallee: [00:20:00] Absolutely. 
It's the exact same thing with your marketing plan. Like you can't, you can't market, market, market, and then stop because you're going to get an influx of clients and then you're going to have no clients. You're going to have an influx of clients.
Absolutely. Absolutely. I've never understood that mentality with, with businesses, with companies. Like if, if it's working, then stop, don't break the system. Now, if it comes down to budgetary, then you need to find, you know, a budget that you can, that you can sit comfortably and consistent with for the long term.
And as the clients go up, your budget's going to increase and then you can build upon that. And I've just never understood why companies like don't get that. It seems like an obvious thing, doesn't it? 
Eric Vallee: Yeah, it does. I mean, I think that a lot of people, they do that. They're like, well, we're doing really well with sales, so we don't need to put as [00:21:00] much into marketing.
We don't need to put, but you always have to think about the funnel. That's something that has to be top of mind because if that funnel is not constantly being filled, you are Really putting yourself in a precarious position. You want to always be filling that funnel. And, you know, the thing is, is when I was working at, uh, my last company, we would have customers that would come in that we weren't sure if they were going to sign right away, but they might sign in a year.
And so if you, if you stop that, who knows what's going to happen. 
Right. Right. Customers who are wildly interested today, but if you go dark for the next year, they're going to forget about you and they're going to sign with somebody else. 
Eric Vallee: Yeah. 
Oh, especially in a wildly competitive industry, depending on the industry that you're in.
If you're a marketing company, that's a saturated industry. If you're a staffing company, saturated industry. You're a, you know, and I can list off [00:22:00] a. You know, a million and 10 saturated industries that, and then there are the, you know, the, the few that, you know, have that corner, their particular industry.
And it's literally said to me, we don't even need a website. And I'm like, good luck when you have a competitor pop up. 
Eric Vallee: Right. Well, that's true. And you know, one of the things I wanted to mention that a lot of people don't realize is with. Leads that come in from your website, something that is really important.
And a lot of companies don't realize, understand where those leads are going, because a lot of times people don't understand that they'll, they'll have a number of different phone numbers that are coming into their website, whether they're using a call center or how they're doing it. They have multiple different places where their emails might be going.
Check those at least A couple times a year to make sure that they're active because nothing is more [00:23:00] frustrating for a customer or a prospect to get to a location. They contact you. They spend the time to reach out and get get to you. And they do it. Never hear back. And one of the challenges with that is that sometimes phone numbers, um, especially now, cause more people are using voice over IP.
And a lot of times these phone numbers aren't going to a voicemail box or, uh, you know, a typical, like a phone number. And so they're just ending in a dead end and people are leaving messages and they're never getting returned. And then it looks bad for that company. So. Right. So 
we, we live in a, we live in a, um, instant gratification world.
Eric Vallee: So if 
I'm looking for a plumber and I always use a plumber or a, you know, cause plumbers, electricians, you know, all of the trades, um, unless I have somebody or somebody has referred a person to me, I'm one of those people who will go [00:24:00] on, you know, like Google and look for. The, you know, the best star review and then start calling down the list and till somebody answers the phone.
If they don't answer the phone, I'm like, I'm moving on because. If they're, and again, I know that there's a lot of, you know, places that are brand new, but like, if you can't answer your phone or respond with a, Hey, like, and I love the text message of, Hey, you know, see that you called to call you back in a couple of minutes.
Great. I'll give them, I'll give them a chance to call me back. But if I don't hear from them within like a reasonable amount of time, I'm moving on. Absolutely. 
Eric Vallee: Absolutely. Absolutely. And, you know, it's so funny that you mentioned that because one of the things that I think is most important with website leads is find a way to get back to somebody Right away, because the thing is, is we're in a society right now where Amazon [00:25:00] has changed the game.
Amazon, you can order something on Amazon at 8 in the morning and have it to your house by noon. And so people have a very high expectation of how they can get in touch with companies. And the, the reality is 77 percent of leads that are submitted through a website. Never get followed up on. 
Mm-Hmm. . 
Eric Vallee: And it's scary because the thing is somebody's reached out to you and they said, I'm interested in your products.
And a lot of companies aren't following up. If you follow up within an hour, you have a much greater chance of getting responded because I, I know that like if, if somebody doesn't have chat on their website. They aren't necessarily expecting that somebody is going to be able to get back to them. A lot of people are conditioned to know that if you call on a phone line, you're probably going to go through voicemail challenges.
And so they understand what [00:26:00] that is. Now, in the case of like a plumber, like you said, I think that's a little bit different. They're probably going to have a call center. But if you contact somebody that's a big company and say, if you're looking for steal, you're probably not going to get in touch with the person right away.
But if you send, if you submit a form, whether it's a request for quote or a contact form, I would encourage anybody, if you can, even if it's just to send them an email and say, Hey, we got it. We got your information. We're looking at it. We'll get back to you. And I'm not talking about the automated one because Most websites have an automated response.
When somebody fills out a form, it'll tell them, we got your information. We're going to respond within a certain amount of time. Right. What I'm talking about is reach out with the salesperson or the person who's managing the leads and say, Thank you for getting back to us. We are working on this and we will get back to you as soon as possible, because then that person knows, Hey, I've reached somebody and [00:27:00] they're going to be more likely to stop looking as hard for another website.
Just like you said, Leanne, if you call a plumber and they don't answer, you're onto the next one. Right. And it's no different with any type of sale. That's how it is. 
Right. So I recently was on a trip and my, um, my girlfriend, , she bought a new car, she bought a Tesla and she asked, or I asked her like, Oh, you know, tell me about like the buying process, blah, blah, blah.
And this was the most insane story I'd ever heard. She's like, yep. We went in, we test drove it. She goes, we filled out everything on an app. And it literally took 15 minutes. We went through it. They, here's the price, here's your, you know, you're putting this much down. This is how much it's going to be, you know, monthly.
She goes, there was no negotiation. There was no, it was, you're pre qualified. This is the price. This is the, you know, how much you're putting down and it's all done in an app. And she goes, it was done in 15 minutes and we drove out with the, with the car. [00:28:00] And I was like, Oh my gosh, like, I know that is like unbelievable.
Like if, if buying a car was that simple, like it would, it wouldn't give me anxiety every time I look at my car thinking I need to buy a new car. If 
Eric Vallee: you talk to, if you talk to, like, if I talked to my mom about it, she'd be like, no, you have to go in and you have to negotiate and you have to go in and yeah.
Right. Holy crap. We're revolutionizing the way that we, that we do like, do just simple things because of technology. And then she went as far as to say, Oh yeah, like you have to, because of the weight of it, you have to have your tires rotated. She goes, I pull up the app. I tell them that I need my tires rotated.
They come to my house. They text me, we're here. She goes, I don't even have to walk out of the house. If it's parked in the garage, they have access through an app. [00:29:00] They rotate the tires and they leave. She goes, it is the most convenient, um, car experience ever. She goes, I love it right now. We're not talking about a 200, 000 car.
We're talking about a, a reasonable. You know, for somebody, some people depend, you know, it's a reasonably priced vehicle that when you talk to somebody who owns one, they're like, Oh my God, I love being a Tesla owner. And I'm like, why? Like I don't get, and then you hear about the experience. This is what the world wants.
Eric Vallee: Absolutely. 
We live in a world in which immediate gratification, simplification. Of the buying process. Is what every single person wants. They want to be able to go on a, they want to go on a website. They want to see what they're buying, [00:30:00] understand the product and then have complete ease in that process, which is why Amazon's, you know, process of.
Like, Oh, here's what I need. I can click on a button and have it delivered to my home. I can even put it on auto ship when I know that I use laundry detergent. You know, I need to restock my laundry detergent and my toilet paper and my every month or every two months it auto ships to my house. Like, 
Eric Vallee: Well, and you know, it's so funny that you're mentioning that because one of the things that I always like to talk to when I talk to salespeople is because salespeople will be like, well, how can I get involved in the SEO process?
And one of the best ways is to be a resource. So some companies will have a digital marketing department. Some might have a marketing manager that and either one might oversee the SEO of a company. Some will hire a consultant like me. What [00:31:00] we really don't have that salespeople do is direct connection to the customer.
And salespeople are talking to customers all the time. So they understand from your business. What are your strengths? What are your weaknesses? What are your competitors strengths? What are the common questions that people ask? All of this information is gold for a website person, because one, it helps us build better content.
Two, it helps us find more unique keywords. Three, it helps us create an experience. Like you said, experience is important. It helps us create an experience that's going to talk to our core customer. So salespeople, I encourage all salespeople, Make friends with your, uh, digital marketing partner because they can be a very good resource for you.
You can be a very good resource for them. [00:32:00] And it's just, it's a great, it's really a great relationship to have. 
Very interesting. So once you have the SEO, like you've created this, you've created the website. Are you good to go forever? 
Eric Vallee: That's a great question, Leanne, because the thing is, is one of the reasons that I got into search engine optimization, when I first started doing digital marketing, I could have went.
Paper click. Um, but I chose to go SEO because the work that you do with SEO, it lasts for a long time. I'm not going to say forever. But it lasts a long time. If you do pay per click or paid advertising, as soon as you stop your paid advertising, it goes away. And so. But as you mentioned, no, you don't want to set it and forget it.
So say, for instance, we have a website that builds widgets and we get all of our pages optimized, we get all of the content that [00:33:00] we want, do we let it go? No, because there's constant changes. It's like a garden. You constantly need to give it attention. Maybe it's the links are break breaking and what a link might be is like on a page you might link between two pages on a website.
Maybe you change the URL of one of the, uh, websites and that breaks. That leads to poor user experience. You, a lot of people don't realize with content, it needs to break. Say if you wrote an article on widgets and we talked about composite widgets, but the composite widgets changed last year, but we wrote this article four years ago.
Well, if somebody goes on that article and they look at composite widgets, they're going to like, well, these guys are behind the times. You know, so you've constantly got to look at your content. Is it updated? You also have to try and look at how can you keep getting your name out there? Once you have a website built.
What other [00:34:00] things can you include in it? The more pages that you have on a website, the better you're going to have to bring in traffic. Because it's like, I try to look at it like when you look at like, where they go after the crabs, and they have all these nets. Each page on your website is like a net, where you're trying to, instead of trying to catch crabs, you're trying to catch customers.
And each page on your website can, can bring in new. Customers and the way you bait that net is with keywords. You find the right keywords that are going to appeal to those, and that will help bring in traffic. Now, that's not to say that you want to just. Have as many pages as you can, and they don't really serve a purpose, but you wanna try to keep building your pages.
There's always ways to build pages. If you look at a, if you have a product page, maybe you have a product page that links to commonly asked questions or your warranty or your returns [00:35:00] or comp, how, how you compare to the competition. There's so many different aspects. So yeah, you. You never want to stop growing your website and you never want to stop managing it and maintaining it.
It's an awesome answer. Um, and, and you're totally right. Like, obviously, but hey, we are coming to time and I want to give you your 30 second shameless pitch, um, before we wrap up. 
Eric Vallee: Okay, great. Yeah. , like I said, I work with people. Big companies, small companies, solopreneurs, uh, you can find me at silverfoxmke.
com. Um, I have a lot of experience in manufacturing. I've done a lot of work in other industries, and I'd be happy to help anybody if they're looking to figure out how they can do better with websites, how they can do better on Google. 
Awesome. And how, what is your, what is your website or how did LinkedIn, how can they reach out to you?
What is the preferred way? 
Eric Vallee: The best way is to go on my website. [00:36:00] It's silver Fox. It's www. silverfoxmke. com. 
Perfect. Well, again, I really appreciate, and that'll be in the show notes, my apologies. So that'll be in the show notes, but I really appreciate you coming on, Eric. It's been an awesome conversation with lots of gold nuggets.
Eric Vallee: Yeah, this has been great. I've really enjoyed it. And thank you for having me on. 
Yeah, it has been my pleasure. 

Expanding Inclusivity: The Neurodivergent Advantage

Join Leighann Lovely on the Love Your Sales Podcast as she dives deep into an enlightening conversation with Denise Schamens, co-founder and executive director of Good Friend Inc. Discover Denise’s personal journey inspired by her son's autism diagnosis and how it led her to create an inclusive community and successful nonprofit. Learn about Good Friend Inc.'s mission to develop films and training curriculums that promote neurodiversity in schools and workplaces. Explore the challenges and successes Denise faces in advocating for neurodivergent individuals in the corporate world. This episode is packed with insights on the importance of inclusivity and the unique strengths neurodivergent individuals bring to any setting. Tune in for an inspiring discussion that highlights the value of diverse thinkers and the push towards more inclusive work environments.
Contact Denise –
Website – www.Goodfriendinc.com
Email - Denise@Goodfriendinc.com   
 
Special Thank you to our Sponsors – Genhead – www.genhead.com and Sales Rescue – www.rescuemysales.com
Robb Conlon – Intro and outro – Westport Studio - https://www.westportstudiosllc.com/
The Brave Ones – Instrumental Version Song by Jan Sanejko - https://artlist.io/royalty-free-music/song/the-brave-ones/119489
 
Ready to grow your business? Schedule a call with us today  - https://api.leadconnectorhq.com/widget/bookings/discoverysalesleighann
Channel Subscribe link - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-O7W9DzaRv4waodQKCprIg?sub_confirmation=1
 
Leighann Lovely: Welcome to another episode of Love Your Sales. I'm very excited today. I am joined by Denise Shamans. She is the co-founder and executive director of Good Friend Inc. Welcome, Denise. I'd love for you [00:01:00] to introduce yourself and your business.
Denise Schamens: Yeah. Hello. Hello. Hello. Um, my, my business is called good friend.
Inc is a nonprofit and we, uh, started back in 2007 and it really, uh, came out of, um, the experience that I was having in my family. So my background is, uh, I'm a creative. I went to school for fine art and commercial art. And then I started having my boys, my two boys, um, who are only 19 months apart. And then I do have a third, my daughter who is college age.
Um, but my middle son, Sam was diagnosed with autism just at three. Uh, so I've been in the autism neurodivergent space for over 20. Five years, he's going to be 26 this week. Um, and it, um, really came out of a desire for a community that was [00:02:00] accepting of his differences. And I found, um, along the path. I had many other hats.
I was a. Parent liaison for the school district of Waukesha. I did that for about 10 years and had a support group, um, was only reaching just a handful of families at the time and, uh, was a large district. We had over 150 families that had some sort of disability or in place. Um, and I couldn't reach them, but what I ended up doing was going into my son's classroom in first, second grade and sitting down with his peers and telling them about him and how they could relate to him, understanding that his autism affected him mostly in his speaking ability.
Um, Not to say that he's nonverbal, he has a lot to say, but can't really get it out. And so, uh, forming friendships was difficult for him. But what I did find was, you know, 27 of his peers were more than happy to be his friend. They just [00:03:00] wanted to know what was up and at the time there was only 1 guidance counselor traveling to all of those 17 elementary schools.
So we weren't talking about differences back then. Um, so I saw a need there. And, uh, there was another mother that was coming to my support group who she was the one that had all the binders on the resources. Like, this is a dentist. Do you want to take them to? This is the camp. You want to send them to all these inclusive communities that already existed.
Um, and so I decided to have a meeting with her and really talk about what we could do with our own. And, um, I wanted to make a film and she came at it from a different perspective, wanting to create, um, a curriculum to surround that film. So we joined forces that was back in 2007 and good friends started.
Um, we created our first film within 3 months. We were in the schools presenting and as. Our kids grew, our company grew. So once our kids got into middle school, we created our [00:04:00] middle school film and curriculum. And then since then we've remade both of them because we've gotten better at videography.
We've gotten better at storytelling. Um, and the language has changed around autism and neurodivergence. So we've made four. To date, we've made now five, um, uh, short documentaries. Um, so as our, as our children grew, our company grew, um, we were up to seven employees at one time. And, uh, we started business coaching right at year 11, and that helped us look at our, our nonprofit as a business, understanding our cash flow, understanding our sales process, understanding, um, all of our procedures, and it was life saving for us, but it was also.
An interesting time in our organization's life, because now our kids were becoming young adults and we as parents were in the transition program. So we didn't know what that meant. We didn't [00:05:00] really know where our space was, um, in the employment space for a while until about 2 and a half years ago, when we finally decided, why aren't we doing what we always do?
And that's create environments that are inclusive. And by doing that. so much. Um, we educate them, um, employers and peers as well on how to be inclusive, how to understand neurodivergence. Cause now, as we've gotten into the adult space, we've expanded it beyond autism. It's now neurodivergent and it, it's all of these brain based conditions that fall within neurodivergence.
So now we're, we've expanded our message to include neurodivergence. All of these conditions, um, and then of course, what we're offering and the education that we're giving is really helpful to everyone. Everyone will benefit from it.
Leighann Lovely: So before we, sorry, I don't want to cut you off, but that is, first of all, it's amazing.
Um, [00:06:00] to, you know, to start from a personal place. Yeah. Um, coming from a personal standpoint to something that's, you know, impacting you on a personal level, but to take that, you know, cause truly this is, this is your, your child's life that you're following. I mean, And, and that in itself is, is absolutely amazing as you've, as you have grown, as your children have grown, you have been able to step into, I don't want to say step into his shoes, but try to help him, you know, grow.
But so let's, let's talk about where you're at right now, because this is where I find it. Vitally important and a shift that has kind of taken place because when you, when you started, there wasn't information and what that was, you said 11, no, he's 20. Yeah, he's 26. So yeah, [00:07:00] what? 20 years, 20 years ago. Yeah.
Talking. Yeah. So when you started, there was no place for people. To get information, there was, I mean, yes, the library, um, but it wasn't, you didn't have, you didn't have your cell phone and I'm holding my cell phone here to be like, Okay. What is this? What's happening?
Denise Schamens: I'll tell you though. It was, you know, at the time the, the diagnostic criteria and the way that we talk about and diagnose autism is different now than it used to be.
There used to be Asperger's, PDD, NOS, and what they used to call low functioning. They blew all those out of the water. And so now when you get an autism diagnosis, it's by level. And I don't really care for level either because I feel like at any given time, it's based on. Support need. So at any given time, you could present as a level two.
Um, but say you're having a really great day and everything's clicking. You could be now a [00:08:00] level one or you're having an off day and nothing's working, then you're a level three. So, um, isn't that for most humans? I know. It's just so. Bizarre, because it's just such a snapshot of time when you're testing, right?
And, um, so yeah, so when I looked online, he was diagnosed with PDD NOS, which is sort of, if you're going to look at it as a spectrum, he's kind of in the middle. And so when I type that into my computer, into the great Google, um, space, I got just not great news. It was kind of like, well, get him into therapy and maybe he'll, you know, have a job or maybe he'll have friendships.
It was dismal. Although now if you put that information in, there's almost too much information and it's like, how do you filter what's, what is good for you and what is not? So. Yes, information has improved. The outcomes have improved. I will say that, um, social media has [00:09:00] been awesome. Knowing, seeing how the landscape has changed in my son's life from me having to go find an adult on the spectrum to be able to see what my son could do.
Accomplish, um, to now you look on tick tock, you look on Instagram, you look anywhere, right? LinkedIn, they're everywhere and they're voicing what their experiences are. So it's like, what an amazing place to be that now they have this voice. So that's cool.
Leighann Lovely: Being, having an outlet to share experiences. To other people, because I mean,
we as humans want to be able to talk to other humans that are experiencing similarities in what we're going through. And often those who may maybe don't have the [00:10:00] verbal ability, like you said, just because you don't speak well, doesn't mean you don't have a ton to say. And sometimes communication in a different way allows for that outlet.
Yeah. Which is, is amazing. Absolutely. It also allows for the ability to find other people. Exactly. Find your community. Your tribe. Yeah. Yeah. Correct. So now, as you've, you know, watched your son grow up, you know, he's, he's going into, you know, different season of life, right? Yes. Yeah. And so this is the thing that I find the most exciting because now you're, Going into a different season in your business where you no longer, and of course you're still catering to schools.
You're still out there doing that. But now you've pivoted to educating employers, which to me is, is, is awesome because employers always seem to be the [00:11:00] last people to go. Oh, yeah, I didn't like, right. Right. There's a wildly brilliant human being that may be. Horrible at interviewing. Yeah. Again, they've got so much to offer.
Yeah. Exactly. Or they may need special accommodation that is really not that hard to accommodate. Right. And they could be Often free. Yeah. Right. Right. There's the simple things. I mean, if, if you have, if you have a, a, an employee in your office that has diabetes and they need, you know, to check their Blood levels or whatever, so that there's an extra time that they spend in the bathroom doing that.
You're not going to say, no, sorry, we can't hire you, right? It's a simple special, and that's probably a bad analogy here. I was just spitballing trying to grab something, right? [00:12:00] The point being, though, is that, you know, you don't automatically say no to somebody simply because there may might be an accommodation that that needs to be made.
If the person can do the job, right? Exactly. Let's talk about the shift that you've made and how has, how has that been different than what you were doing in the past?
Denise Schamens: Well, yeah, like I said, we weren't really sure where our space was. And so I think we kind of avoided it for a while until we just went back to what we always do.
And that's create a film and create a training curriculum to surround that film. Um, so what we did was we put an ask out there for, um, To find a near divergent employees that were successful in their career, um, successfully employed and, um, that was all neurodivergent. And so we put that out. I put it out on LinkedIn [00:13:00] and we got quite a few candidates.
that came forward on their own, not because their employer asked them to come forward. They came forward because they wanted to make a difference. They wanted to share their story. And so like all the training that we've ever done, when it's in video format, we do a, we do a documentary style so that you can connect and hear their story, their own personal story.
It's not me telling you what it is, um, as an ally. I'm only here to amplify their voice. I'm not their voice. And so I needed to make sure that we had an age range. So I think it's 22 to 52 and, uh, half women, half men, and, uh, It was an interesting experiment because each of them had their own journey of to be successfully employed.
And so this film highlights them highlights and shows their diagnostic story. Um, more than half of them were late diagnosed. Uh, so they went to [00:14:00] seek out a right diagnosis later in life. Um, so it touches on some things that I think are inherently wrong with our. Our testing process, um, number, the biggest one is trying to find someone who diagnoses someone as an adult, um, and then making that more cost effective for them because that's out of pocket to do so.
And then once you have that information, what do you do with that? And so many of the people in our film took that. Now correct diagnosis and just gave themselves more grace in their workplace and in their setting goals for themselves, um, with this new lens of being autistic. So it was, uh, it was really an interesting, um, and still is the film is just powerful for you to see how different each individual is and.
What it took for them to get that diagnosis. And then with that, we took additional footage with them and then brought in some subject matter experts. So we have 5. Individual [00:15:00] training modules that kind of dive deeper into what made them successful in the workplace. And so that's all offered as a course.
So it's great for employers. It's great for anyone. That is, um, working with someone who's neurodivergent. And if you look at. What all falls under neurodivergence that's about 40 percent of our population. So we need to be talking about this. We need to have this training. Um, I just recently did a really powerful screening and talk back.
With, um, UW Madison's, uh, School of Theater and Drama. And that was amazing because they had two, um, individuals on their, as colleagues on their staff that were neurodivergent that wanted to help run this. And it was beautiful because we took the film by chapter by chapter, and we were able to have such a rich discussion around what made them successful and, um, what, you know, didn't work out for [00:16:00] them.
That was an amazing thing. So it's like when you think about what's the perfect client, the perfect client is anyone who is employing other people, right? And
Leighann Lovely: So, um, you threw out a number there. 40 percent is neurodivergent. Do you think, do you, do you think that that number could potentially be higher because there are so many people that are late diagnosed? I mean, or undiagnosed or right. Or undiagnosed. And cause I think about that and there are people that I meet and I think to myself, and this is horrible.
Maybe it's not horrible, but I think to myself like. Especially being somebody who has bipolar disorder. Right. And I talk about this all the time and I, and I see, I see certain signs in them and I'm like, have you, have you ever. See a psychiatrist, have you? And I say it in the most loving and caring way, but they'll come to me and they're, and, and a lot of people talk to me [00:17:00] about mental health because I am open about talking about mental health.
Yeah. Right. I'll say, have you ever seen a medical, you know, a psychiatrist or a therapist and talked about some of these signs and sign? No, no, no. I would never do that. And I think, God, I swear. Yeah. Like at least 80 percent of the population is, is somewhere. On some spectrum of something.
Denise Schamens: Yeah. I think those numbers would be staggering
Leighann Lovely: if it was more accurate for sure.
As do I. And that's why, you know, having a platform, a comfort, you know, a place of comfort to, to talk about this and why I think it's so wildly important that this type of training take place. And this brings me to my next question. How is it going with getting. Buy in from these companies in comparison to, you know, you can walk into a school and say, Hey, this is great.
I'm going to guess schools were much [00:18:00] more like, yeah, let's bring this in because it was kind of a no brainer. Let's educate, but where, where is it standing right now with getting the buy in from. Employers.
Denise Schamens: Yeah. Well, I'll tell you it's, it's not as quick. So the corporate world to your point is really slow to make decisions like this.
And, and I don't blame them because there is a cost involved. It costs, you know, to, um, have this training to implement this training to more than 1 person. And it needs to be in your budget. And so we are running across those kinds of situations where they have to. Find the number 1, see the value in a training like this.
And then where does it fit? Or are they already paying what we're running into with some of the larger financial industries is, you know, we've already contracted with this large training organization that does all of these D. I. [00:19:00] trainings and safety videos. And why would yours be any different? And it's like, but ours is ours is it's not It isn't, it all is these people that have such great, um, impact and you learn from them.
You learn from hearing in their story. And so it's been, it's been a little slow, you know, trying to get people to see the value in this. And we're so small, like we have a, we have a contracted marketing company that's doing amazing things for us. Um, but it is literally just meeting with everyone. I have to have, Probably, oh, four to five one on ones every week just to show them what this product is.
So it's a, it's a slow sale.
Leighann Lovely: And I understand that. And it, it makes sense budgeting. You know, I've been in the training and development where, you know, companies, well, we've got X amount for budgeting, but when we talk about 40 percent of the population and you and I talk about, Yeah, right. It's [00:20:00] not 40%. It's way up there.
My question to them would be, how are you not immediately putting this in the budget when you're talking about one, increasing the population of people that you could hire when how many people who are neurodiverse Go without a job. I know that, you know, a number around there somewhere. It's like one 80%.
Yeah. I was going to say 80 percent like one in four or something. Yeah. Or is that backwards?
Denise Schamens: Yeah. It's definitely like 80 to 85 percent are under or unemployed. Okay. Right. Everybody's
Leighann Lovely: looking. Correct. And if an employer right now is suffering to hire the correct or hire more people and they understand what it might look like and what it takes in order to hire a population of people that right now are [00:21:00] under or unemployed, how can you not try to understand how to do this?
Most employers, if you are a large employer. If you have, you know, 100 employees, I guarantee that you have somebody who is neurodiverse working at your company. You may not know it, right? Or you may think you might, they may have not disclosed to you out of fear. And there's a lot of people out there that don't disclose out of fear.
But if you were to get this, you know, if you get this training going, right? Yeah,
Denise Schamens: it's to, to kind of put it in perspective. I mean, an ideal world world for me and what I'm kind of trying to achieve and I probably won't in my lifetime. Is a workplace or is all workplaces that are so inclusive and so universally designed that you don't even need to disclose.[00:22:00]
Correct. It doesn't matter what whatever the label is, whether you're diagnosed or not diagnosed. If everything, if all these accommodations are already there and you've been taught to be an inclusive. Thriving company, then. That's perfect, right? That's what I'm trying to gain from this and the larger companies that are in the thousands or global organizations that are looking at us, which is lovely.
They want to know if it's culturally. Sensitive to their global partners. And I get that. And I, and I think it would be, I think that once we can get that, um, underway and they can see the film and the value of what these people are bringing, that's the thing. It's not me talking about their autism or their neurodivergence or how to hire them.
It is. Them talking about what works for them. How can you argue with that? How can that not be culturally sensitive, right? Because it's their own personal stories of success. So [00:23:00] it's really, uh, for some of these larger organizations that have DER, they're DEI groups or ERG groups or BRG groups, those business resource groups.
Those are the ones that are already thinking inclusively. So this is perfect. This rolls right into their initiatives. But what I feel like is the companies that don't even realize. That they need this training. Um, those are the ones that I need to try to speak to because they already have them. It's, it's different when you're trying to hire and attract that talent, which we can help you do that.
But it's also retaining what you already have and understanding that they may need to go and get a diagnosis or they may be just finding out while they're working for you. So those are important things to, to think about too, is just retaining what you already have, the talent that you have. And then, of course, we're all about collaboration.
So what we're trying to do is just on the front front end. We're just trying to help change hearts and [00:24:00] minds, helping employers see the value of it. And then we're connecting them with the organizations that are doing the placement, like the engage, like thinkability, like mind shift, right? There's so many organizations out there that are placing.
Neurodivergent people in their field, whether that's manufacturing or tech or HR or whatever that might be. So we're not doing all of it. We're just trying to help them see how you can build that framework to accept, um, all those diverse thinkers. Right.
Leighann Lovely: And
having that diversity. And we, we talk about this all the time. If you have a room of all the same person, Right. No new ideas ever will come out of that room. Or growth. Or growth. Right. But if you have. You know, [00:25:00] a wide variety of people, and we're talking about race, we're talking about religion, we're talking about neurodiverse individuals.
Think about all of the different viewpoints that could potentially come out of that room. I mean, especially. You know, I, I, I, some people hate when I say like, Oh, my superpower is some people like eat, but I truly believe that along with what people consider and I don't like saying like, Oh, I bipolar, my, my disability is I have bipolar disorder.
I don't think of it as a disability.
Denise Schamens: Right
Leighann Lovely: now it's a hurdle that at one point in my life, I, I had to, You know, get diagnosed. I had to get on the right medication. I had to get on the right, you know, regiment of life in order to, you know, function in what society would call a norm. But along with that, there are things that are different within my own brain that I consider to be [00:26:00] kind of a superpower.
Yeah. I mean, because my, for, I don't mind doesn't function the same way as what we. Consider the norm. What is the norm in your own majority? It's
Denise Schamens: the majority. That's becoming we've already proven that the party is not anymore.
Leighann Lovely: Right? I mean, if when information goes in to somebody's brain, Everybody processes it so completely differently.
I like that. I do too. I like that the way that I think, you know, my husband will look at me and go, what's, what is going on in your brain right now? And I'm like, I'm, you know, I'm, I'm a puzzle. I like to put, pieces together. Like I like to, you know, I'm an op, right now I'm working in operations. I like to figure out how do I put this together with this together with this to make the complete Yeah, puzzle work.
Yeah, you know, and like my husband will make [00:27:00] reference to something and all of a sudden it triggers somebody in my head and I'm off and doing this and doing this and then I'm writing on a little sheet of paper and he's like, what are you talking about? And I'm like, Oh, I need to introduce this to this to this.
And he's like, I referenced a movie. And I'm like, yeah, it made me think of this. Yeah. That's how my brain works. Yeah. I, I love that about every human is uniquely different. I love the stories about how, you know, everybody processes that information in their own way to make them uniquely them. Yeah. And the more that we have that, The more powerful we are as a company, as a society, as a world.
And if we allow people that instead of trying to say, Oh no, you have to think like this, right. Well, what,
Denise Schamens: yeah, the biggest takeaway that I've, I've been able to give when we [00:28:00] present, um, neurodiversity at work. Is really to just be curious and it's okay. Give them permission. It's okay to ask questions. It's okay to pull together a group.
Um, of unique thinkers and get their input and get there. I mean, that's the best thing in the world. I think is asking as many questions. Like, what do you need to be successful in your workplace? What can I do to help you be successful and ask them just ask them questions? How do you like to be identified?
Right? When we're looking at identity and. And all of that. So it's just being inquisitive and it's being, it's okay to ask questions. There's no taboo against it. It's okay. And I think that's been the biggest thing for employers to wrap their head around is that they don't need to have all the answers.
They just need to, to ask the people that are working for them.
Leighann Lovely: I think the other thing is, is that so many employers are afraid of making a mistake. Yeah. And therefore they [00:29:00] just shy away. Yeah. From what they don't know. Right. Ask.
Denise Schamens: And it's bringing value to your, your employees then too. I mean, you're placing value on them by asking.
Their opinion on something, or ask how, you know, they could make improvements or what the suggestion or advice would be. How can you, you have to, you have to use those people in your life and use them. Like you said, the, the superpowers that they have. There may be things that you just hadn't even thought of that they can bring new perspective to it.
Leighann Lovely: Absolutely. It's just like bringing in, you know, I'm, I'm 43 bringing in a young, young buck into, sorry, I shouldn't say, but bringing in a young mind, as scary as it is because they're talking about all these, I'm like, I don't even know what that is. And they're like, Oh, it's the newest bubble. And I'm okay.
Great. But it's scary. Cause they're talking about things that I don't even know what they are, but it's [00:30:00] great. That's where we are. Right. Bringing a new perspective. So we are coming to time. Um, this has been an amazing conversation. I love the growth that, um, that, that you have. And I love the fact that you're moving into employers.
Um, yeah, it's just Denise, it's been such a great conversation. Um, and you know, for those of you who have followed my, um, my podcasting career, Denise was actually, um, On a previous podcast that I had, um, so if you want to check out that original episode, you can actually reference back to let's talk HR, um, where she actually, um, had joined.
Those are still live, but you can get that original one out. But again, Denise, it's been such an awesome time. I really appreciate it. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you for the opportunity. Yes. Oh, and I, I give everybody their, their, their 30 second shameless pitch. Um, I think we've talked quite a bit about everything, but please, um, if you want to drop anything [00:31:00] where people can reach out to you, go ahead.
Denise Schamens: Yeah, I mean, please find me on LinkedIn. I'm a huge connector on LinkedIn, and I love to make to do one on one. So if you have interest and you want to sit down and talk about what we're doing and what we need as far as time, talent and resources, um, you can find me on LinkedIn, Denise Shamans, as well as, um, feel free to email me at D E N I S E at Goodfriendinc.
com and that's mine. And then our website is goodfriendinc. com. So those are all the all places you can find me. And that'll be in the show notes. Thank you so much. Thank you. Take care.
Genhead: This [00:32:00] podcast is presented by Genhead. Genhead leverages AI so small and medium sized businesses can find their ideal clients to make more sales. Other companies talk about AI, but we are using it every day to drive down marketing costs and increase revenue. Learn more at genhead. com. That's genhead. com.

Sales, Success, and Stabilizing Hypochlorous Acid: A CEO's Journey

On this enlightening episode of the "Love Your Sales" podcast, Leighann Lovely sits down with Bill Maher, an esteemed business leader and current CEO of Curitiba Bay Incorporated. Bill shares captivating stories from his remarkable career, including his military service, the successful sale of his electrical engineering firm, and his venture into stabilizing hypochlorous acid—a game-changing product with vast potential in healthcare. Their discussion encompasses the challenges of entrepreneurship, the importance of maintaining strong organizational culture, and the evolving dynamics of modern business practices. Bill's incredible journey offers valuable insights and inspiration for aspiring entrepreneurs and seasoned business professionals alike. Don't miss this episode filled with real-world wisdom and innovative ideas.
Contact Bill 
Website – www.curativabay.com
Phone – 727-742-6636
 
Special Thank you to our Sponsors – Genhead – www.genhead.com and Sales Rescue – www.rescuemysales.com
 
Robb Conlon – Intro and outro – Westport Studio - https://www.westportstudiosllc.com/
 
The Brave Ones – Instrumental Version Song by Jan Sanejko - https://artlist.io/royalty-free-music/song/the-brave-ones/119489
 
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Channel Subscribe link - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-O7W9DzaRv4waodQKCprIg?sub_confirmation=1
 
Leighann Lovely: Welcome to another episode of Love Your Sales. I am so thrilled. I am joined by Bill Maher. He is a business leader known for his innovation and expertise in technology and healthcare. Currently holds the position of CEO at Curitiba Bay Incorporated. Maher is responsible for overseeing the production of stabilizing hyperchlorous acid, a natural antiviral agent recognized for its effectiveness in fighting [00:02:00] pathogens.
 Curetiva Bay, Maher successfully led a respectful electrical engineering firm with a global presence. Under his guidance, the company expanded to five offices across the United States and Hong Kong, solidifying its position as a key player in the industry. Mayor played a pivotal role in the development of more than 6, 000 critical power systems, including the renowned launch pad 39A for the space shuttle program.
Mayor's leadership and strategic Acunam propelled the electrical engineering company to unprecedented success, accumulating in its. Acquisition by NASDAQ list Corporation. With a proven track record of leadership and innovation, Bill continues to drive progress and excellence in the technology and healthcare sector, leaving a lasting imprint on industries that shape our [00:03:00] future.
Bill served in the U. S. Navy from 1971 to 1975, specializing in air launched weapons specialists
abroad, the U. S. S. Forrest, all CVA 59. Additionally, he holds a pilot's certificate bill. I am so happy to have you join me today.
Bill Maher: It's a pleasure. Thank you very much.
Leighann Lovely: Yeah. So obviously I read this, you know, little bio on you, but is there anything that I missed?
Bill Maher: Uh, no, no, just, uh, that's pretty much it in a nutshell.
Leighann Lovely: So why don't you tell, you know, currently you are the CEO of Curitiba Bay. Tell me a little bit about, you know, what this business is. What, what do, what do you do?
Bill Maher: Well, it was kind of a mistake. It was nothing I planned. Um, I had just, uh, came out of selling my company to a NASDAQ listed company. So it turned into a publicly [00:04:00] traded company. And, um, and I left that company after about a year and I was with a friend and he asked me, have I ever heard of something called hypochlorous acid?
And I said, no, never heard of it. And he said, well, there's a doctor down in Fort Lauderdale, which we're in Tampa Bay. He said, let's take a ride down. This is supposed to be pretty special and he wants us to help him sell it. So we went down there and when I, I never heard of hypochlorous, but when I found out that it, it kills all viruses, it, um, it's so safe that you can drink it.
It's made out of dead sea salt and purified water. And we put an electrical current through it and it brings out something called hypochlorous acid, which is in your, in the human immune system. If you didn't have it, you wouldn't heal wounds, wouldn't get rid of colds. It's pretty important for the human body.
Um, after a couple of hours, I was blown away by it. I was getting pretty excited. And then I found out that it was not stable, which means you cannot keep it in a bottle for longer than maybe 3 days. And it would it turns right back to [00:05:00] salt water again. So I didn't see any. Future in that, uh, the next day I was called to Seattle for, uh, for a consulting, an engineering consulting job.
And I thought, I'll take that, you know, nothing else to do. So I flew to Seattle the next day.
Leighann Lovely: Nothing else to do this. Sorry. I'm sorry. Nothing else to do. You're you just sold your company and you're you're how old at this point?
Bill Maher: Oh, when I sold the company, I was
Leighann Lovely: So you, you could have just, you know, gotten on your boat and, and retired at this point.
Bill Maher: Yeah. Well, you could have, but I started thinking the older you get, the more wisdom you have and you think in yourself, well, how many times can I go drinking beer on my boat? So this is,
Leighann Lovely: so I just want to point out, this is the true entrepreneurial spirit of someone who, Just loves what they do and does what they love.
So, sorry, go ahead. It was good.
Bill Maher: So I flew to [00:06:00] Seattle and we did the 1st full day and it's in his plant. And it's building and and then he's invited me out to dinner and he also brought a friend of his had nothing to do with our meeting. Just a friend was. Hanging out with him. So I asked the friend, you know, what do you do for a living?
And he said, well, you probably never heard of this, but we figured out a way to stabilize something called hypochlorous acid. And I almost fell off my chair and I thought, well, this is, this is a divine intervention or something, something, some, it just, the odds, I should have stopped in Las Vegas. On the way back, so I decided that I, I knew that the spray itself, I could say that it, it gets, it'll relieve people of acne in about four days.
You just spray it on your face. It's like, uh, salt water, but it's not gonna right. The hypochlorous in it, it clears up the acne real fast. Uh, it heals wounds really quick. So that was another application, um, and and also it kills all viruses, although we make no claims about that, you know, so, [00:07:00] um, it's I've never done this business before.
This is a. Online business, we have a little store here too, but. Uh, if I didn't have the experience of operating a business for 30 years, um, I probably would have gone out of business the 1st year. It was just a money hungry machine. And, uh, it was terrible. Uh, at 1st, you know, because I didn't have any marketing experience.
No social media experience. You know, I do. I did things like I answered the telephone and talk to people and they didn't even know how to do it. You know, they were ready to leave a message, you know, so it was hard. I think the first year, second year, we lost huge amounts of money. And now, now, and I, we were the first people in this space.
So nobody knew about it. Nobody understood what I did. I don't do it now sell on Amazon, but when I tried to sell on Amazon, it took them six months to approve it because they never heard of it before. Now there's now that now I came out [00:08:00] and didn't do any advertising. I just basically got the sales up and now there's probably about 15 competitors.
And they're in all the beauty stores and everywhere, you know, and I'm still just selling out of our office here,
Leighann Lovely: but
Bill Maher: we're doing quite well now and growing every day.
Leighann Lovely: Interesting.
Bill Maher: And then there was a little stint I did between the electrical engineering business and this business. Uh, I was in, we did a lot of work in Hong Kong and China and I found these little microscopic balls that they made out of bauxite ore in China.
They're the size of a pencil tip. But if you were to take a hammer and hit them, you couldn't hardly break them. They would hold 20, 000 PSI pounds per square inch. Right? So I thought my friend who was in the oil business, he was a petroleum engineer. I said, how do they open up the fractures when they fracture a well, because it's so deep and he says they use sand.
And I said, do you think we can get them to use these, these balls? And he said, well, let's because they're not, they're not [00:09:00] they're natural. Right. So we went to Halliburton and after about a year of begging, they finally gave us a chance and they improve their, their well, um, their, their production by 600 barrels a day.
So we, we started importing, we would bring 3000 pounds, super sacks, 10Million pounds at a time from China to, um, to, uh, the port city. And we ship it across the ocean to Seattle and put it on it. We rent a whole train and put it on a train. We're delivering 10 million pounds a month to Palo Verde and whiting oil and gas.
And that went on for got the 1st year. We did that. We did 32Million dollars in business, just 2 people. And it was a fun business, but boy, it was hard. We're in the oil fields at 40 below 0, you know, where you can pinch the cheeks and it would stay that way and stuff. And I'm for it. I'm a Florida guy. So.
Leighann Lovely: Right.
Bill Maher: Um, we had to, we had to give that up in 2014 because they had a manipulated oil price. Crude price went from [00:10:00] 95 a barrel down to 30 a barrel. And uh, we were the most expensive thing on the, on the well. Um, we were 600, 000 a well for products. So they went back to sand.
Leighann Lovely: So that's three businesses.
Yeah. So
Bill Maher: let's,
Leighann Lovely: let's go back. So you know, you, you were in, uh, you were in the Navy. Let's start with this. You got out of the Navy. And did you immediately have the itch to become an entrepreneur?
Bill Maher: No, I didn't know I was not educated. And you know, for me to start my electrical engineering business, I had to be, uh, I had to have a BS degree, put it that way.
And, uh, but you know, God has given me miracles all my life. And I was man, I was, my job was managing the construction of data centers. When data centers, the dotcoms are out a lot, you know, and, and, uh, [00:11:00] one of the guys I befriended took him fishing on my boat and everything like that, all the time. He came to me one day and he said, Hey, you know, I'm so mad at these electronic engineers because we have these big power systems and they, they won't touch the batteries.
I wish I knew somebody who could maintain the batteries. And I said, what would I, what would, what would you do? He said, well, I'd give him all my work. He, he's, uh, a manager of a $60 billion company. Um. And they do big power systems manufacturing. Right? So I went down at Reagan was president then, and I went down and started my business in about a day for 50.
It wasn't like it is now and opened up my shop. And he came in the next day with a stack about that, that high of folders. And he said, here's all of our customers. Leave us 15%. So I went out and started doing maintenance by myself on all these battery systems, right? Cause it wasn't that hard. And next thing you know, you know, I'm by myself.
And back in 1989, I was making 35, 000 a month.
Leighann Lovely: And [00:12:00]
Bill Maher: then we, we turned that into stationary power was the name of the company. And when we sold it, we were, we were revenuing 50 million. And it was so funny because when I started this business, I had a little baby, my daughter was a baby, you know, I was watching her and I was actually working in her bedroom.
So I would have these old phone where people would call and I say, oh, I don't know. Hold on a 2nd. Let me hook you over to engineering. And then I put it on hold and I come back, say engineering, you know, change my voice. I imagine many people could probably come up with what they did when they started their business, but stationary power was we were in 5 states, you know, and it was a great company.
Um, and it was purchased by a NASDAQ traded company, a public publicly traded company.
Leighann Lovely: Yeah. And
Bill Maher: they ran it out a bit. They ruined our, our culture, ruined the culture for the customers. NASA used to come to my office and change into shorts when they were discussing change orders for the space, the launch pad.
Right. And, and then, so they [00:13:00] went out of business in three years. Not that not the whole company, but they had to fold the division that when they bought our company,
Leighann Lovely: right?
Bill Maher: No, which wasn't cheap. And, uh, so that was unfortunate. But
Leighann Lovely: yeah, you can't, uh, you can't continue to maintain. Um, well, If you're, if you're not willing to understand the organization and the way that it was built when you buy it and you just go in and start strong, strong arming or not paying attention to the way that it was originally run, it's, it's unfortunate that that that happens with, with companies.
So how many
Bill Maher: college educated people. No, no offense to them. I'm not at all tend to be younger when they get into these positions and it takes wisdom,
Leighann Lovely: you
Bill Maher: have to have wisdom to think about what, do I want to change that culture to my culture, which is strictly wrong it's, you know, it's, it's. But in fact, when I mentioned that [00:14:00] to the board of directors and they called the president about it, he fired me.
Leighann Lovely: Wow.
Bill Maher: It's not a big deal. I didn't need to work there. I didn't do nothing when I sold it anyway, but you know, it's like, he didn't want me to go around. I've talked to him already. I said, you're going to run this company out of business. I said, it's three years. It's gone. And it was three years. Right.
Leighann Lovely: Wow.
And so let's talk about that because, you know, there's a lot of young entrepreneurs that are popping up and which is awesome. I love to see, um, you know, younger people coming in and, you know, really showing what they're capable of doing. I will tell you myself that when I was in my twenties, um, I didn't have the wisdom that I have now, and I, I wouldn't have been able to start and maintain and run my own business.
I know this of myself now. I'm not saying that that is that that's everybody. Um, [00:15:00] but there is something to be said about life experience. Um, that cannot be taught, that cannot be trained, that cannot be in any way given to somebody else without living and going through the motions of, of life.
Bill Maher: Yeah.
Leighann Lovely: So tell me a little bit about, you know, I guess that journey, the, the pains, the hardships of your previous, you know, business, your, your business today.
Bill Maher: Well, I mean, okay. So I made some mistakes that I learned from, and I would probably make the same choice if I, if I went back. So September 11th came. And we were, I had all my core group of people were working here and I had 5 other offices, but they were not my core. My core was here. They were all with me for 15 years.
I watched their kids grow up when [00:16:00] September 11th hit and the dot coms had a failures had failures. We were, we were shorted 800000 dollars on jobs. We did for the dot coms that we had to go through and all that kind of stuff like that. And so we got in a bad, bad way for a couple of years where it was extremely successful, extremely, uh, uh, stressful.
So, uh, I didn't want to lay off any of these people. And all my friends were saying, man, you're going, you know, you're having these problems and I went 2. 8 million into debt, uh, just keeping them employed. Cause I, I just knew that something was going to come right. And, uh, and we had to do a lot of things like they might not think about unless they had the experience.
For instance, after we fixed all that problem. And we're back after we, uh, we, we sold 1 division of the telecommunications division to, to a publicly traded company and got some cash was able to pay that debt off. But during that time, you know, we wanted to get another credit line. We needed a credit line to run the business.
Our cash flow was at that time with 800, 000 a month. [00:17:00]
Leighann Lovely: So,
Bill Maher: um, so what, uh, we had a guy, one of our best engineers bought so much of this equipment that was the wrong voltage. We couldn't return it.
Leighann Lovely: Oh my God. It was
Bill Maher: getting over in our other warehouse for a long, long time. And I thought, how am I going to get this credit line?
How am I going to get the credit line? You got to be patient, right? So I, I wrote off that inventory, which is if you're a publicly traded company, you just can't, if you write it off, you can, but you got to throw it away. We didn't throw it away. So the next year we were doing a lot better and we were, that voltage for that machine that we didn't need, now we needed it.
So we started selling these big jobs with these new 480 volt systems. And, um, we, uh, We were realizing a lot, a lot of a lot of revenue and no cost because we had no cost that was written off. Right. And that made our bottom line look really good. And we were able to secure a 5M credit line. [00:18:00] So, um, you know, it just took a lot of, you know, what you don't know how to solve the problem.
And 1st, you just have to go through it and you have to say, do I go this way? Do I go that way? And sometimes you're right and sometimes you're wrong, you know, you want to make that ratio a little bit better on the right side. Right. So that's what, you know, then we started getting, we were lean and mean, everybody was experienced.
We, we, we beat the, we beat a union up in Pennsylvania that was trying to knock us out of business. You know, that's a long story. It was Verizon, but, uh, we finally got to a point where we were doing really well, and we had a good name. A really good name. So,
Leighann Lovely: you
Bill Maher: know,
Leighann Lovely: I commend you, um, you know, businesses today and I, I don't, I don't want to pick on businesses today, but I'm going to.
I don't want to, but I'm going to. You know, businesses are not like they were there. There was [00:19:00] loyalty in employees and there was loyalty in businesses today. It is so not that way. There is no loyalty towards, you know, if. If an employee screws up, there's, there's, they're quick to get them out the door and just say goodbye.
Employees, the same thing. Employees are like, yeah, I don't like it here anymore. And they're just quick to jump ship. And, but you know, but you're talking about, I mean, 9 11, that was, you know, God, I, I, I'm dating myself when I say, you know, like I remember sitting at work the day that that happened, but that, that was so long ago at this point, like my, my, and it's really funny cause yesterday my husband made a comment about Janet Jackson in this incident that she was on stage and I'm like, Oh, that wasn't that long ago.
And he goes, yeah, it was.
Bill Maher: And
Leighann Lovely: I'm like, what? No, it wasn't. And he goes, we were watching a show and he goes, this kid just said he wasn't [00:20:00] born when that happens, when that happened. And I went, Oh, Oh my God. Like there's people out there who are old enough to be like adults and they weren't born when that happened.
I'm like, wow, I'm getting old. But anyways, I digress. I, you know, you don't realize like how long ago these things happen. And anyways, the point that I'm making is the loyalty that you showed. The, by, by keeping your employees employed and going into debt that much, that, that shows an amazing one culture, but wow, that, I mean, that's, that's a company that I would have wanted to work at.
And when you have a company that people want to work at, want to stay at, that's a company that I, as a consumer want to work with. [00:21:00] It, it, cause it, it go, it, it all trinkles down, right? Happy employees, happy culture usually means happy clients because they have a smile on their face when they're picking up the phone and working with their, their consumers, their clients.
They're so it sounds just from the way that you described that short thing, you did have an amazing culture and it's unfortunate when you turn around and sell that, that it's so quickly was squashed.
Bill Maher: Well, the culture, I mean. When you go to lay off people, you're not just laying off people and wrecking a family for a little while,
Leighann Lovely: you're laying
Bill Maher: capabilities.
And
 when you lay off capabilities, your companies, that's what I think some people don't realize is you're laying off capabilities. You can't get them back. You know, you can't get the people that, you know, can lace cable and do all these specific jobs that we had. And, uh, and plus, you know, they, they were with me when they, they were, you know, got married.
They had kids. We saw him at the Christmas [00:22:00] party and that sort of thing. So you have to have the problem with today. What I see in running this business right here is that nobody talks to each other anymore. Nobody communicates if they don't want to talk to you. They just don't call you. They don't answer the phone.
And, um, that's 1 of the reasons it's my company. I said, the only job I had at the end was I sat in my office. I got the service reports from the service text that went out to all my customers. And I called every single 1 of them every month, every 3, every 90 days. And we had conversations, friendly conversations, so I could keep figuring out if they were okay with what we were doing.
Um, and I remember the customers calling me and, you know, giving us jobs that we didn't think we were going to get. You know, the, the communication was great in this business. Uh, today you can't, everybody has to do everything electronically. They hide behind it, you know, and we answered our phone here at this company every day.
I do every day for every customer. We take care of problems just like that, you know, and you can see it in our reviews. [00:23:00]
Leighann Lovely: And that makes all of the difference, the, the. And you're right, people do hide behind, and it, and it makes it easier for people to brush things, conflict, brush it away as if it doesn't exist when you're hiding behind, you know, you and I are talking in Zoom.
It's, it's much easier for me. It's not for me, but much easier for people to be like, uh, I, I'm not thinking of that person as a real person with real emotions, with real family issues, with real, when you and I have never actually met in person,
Bill Maher: you
Leighann Lovely: know, because you're not, it's easier for somebody to think that they're not a whole person when I'm only seeing you in a box.
Bill Maher: And,
Leighann Lovely: and again, that's, you know, with the whole pandemic businesses saying, we want you back in the office. We want the human contact and, and [00:24:00] the younger generation is arguing what we do. We, we talk this way. We talk on tax. We talk, it's not the same.
Bill Maher: Not
Leighann Lovely: that I'm arguing that every job has to be done in an office, but relationships are struggling because of that human interaction that not zoom human interaction, not phone human, talking about actual in person interaction.
There's something to be said from standing next to somebody and being able to see their facial expressions, their body reaction. If I step closer, do they move away? Like, are they, are they the kind of person that doesn't like to be in close proximity? That says a lot about a personality and to get to know that personality, it really, truly does.
The
Bill Maher: human touch, we call it. You know, you need to have the human touch and, and, you know, it's, it seems like society at some point is going to spiral out of control because, uh, because of it, [00:25:00] you know, we're getting too much technology, um, and not enough, um, talking to each other.
Leighann Lovely: Yeah, I am in a, in a pool league and there is, um, 1, 1 gentleman who's 21 and 1 gentleman who's 25 and I find it, they always have earbuds in.
Yeah. Yet when I approach them and I say something to them, they respond right back. And so one day I said to them, what's with the earbuds? Because you can hear me. You talk to me. If I talk to you, you respond, but you always have them in. And so. One of them said, well, I'm listening to music, but really low.
So I can still hear. And I said, well, there's music in here. And he goes, yeah, it's not my type of music.
I'm like, like, so this is, this is the younger generation coming up is that they walk around with their own personal music in their head it's low enough. So they can still [00:26:00] talk. So they're like. They want to be out in society, but they also are like in their own heads. It's it is a bizarre and I don't think of myself as old.
Like, I'm, I'm 43 years old. I, I feel like I'm still in touch,
Bill Maher: but
Leighann Lovely: clearly I'm not
Bill Maher: happy to be how old I am.
I've, I've been through the best of time. So. You know, uh, it was, it was actually really good up until about 4 years ago. You know, that then people started getting. You know, we're being pushed apart, uh, in certain ways that we all know, and, and against each other, one's against this one, this one's against that one, and people have no problem saying the nastiest things when all they're doing is typing it out and they don't have to see you.
Leighann Lovely: Correct.
Bill Maher: And that that's turning the society into kind of mean streak, you know, and
Leighann Lovely: I [00:27:00] guarantee that if you were to, you know, especially when it comes to politics, especially, and I'm not going to get into any, trust me, I'm not going to start, I guarantee that if all of a sudden you took like, and some of these strings where it degrades into these horrible, if you were to say to all these people, Hey, Hey, I'm going to take you into a room with all of these people that you have screamed at, yelled at, called names, and you have to stand in a room and face them.
They'd be like, no, no, no, I'm not going to do that. I'm not, I'm no, I'm not. But you're more than willing to say these horrible, nasty things, name, call them, tell them how stupid they are for their own personal beliefs online.
Bill Maher: Yeah. I think, I think it's going to, a lot's going to change, uh, in the next. Four or five years for the better.
Leighann Lovely: I hope a
Bill Maher: lot of people are realizing, you know, when they see this, that, you know, we're going in the wrong direction, but [00:28:00] we'll see, you know,
Leighann Lovely: yeah. So we're, we're getting off topic here. Let's get, let's, I'm going to revert back here. So, so you, you've obviously, you owned a wildly successful business for many years.
And so now you, you've. We're gonna bring this back to current. You had dinner, you know, with a friend that now has sparked this. Oh my gosh, I can stabilize this. Hypochlorous Chlor. Yeah. Yeah. Hypochlorous acid. So you then went back down the path of I'm gonna create this business. At that time, you were the only one in the market.
You now have competitors. So let's talk a little bit more about where you are currently with, you know, your product and you know, what, what, what sparked this. New [00:29:00] entrepreneurs, you know, ship journey and, you know, yeah, let's talk a little bit more about that
Bill Maher: 7 days a week. Um, you know, I'm, I'm not living the perfect life right now.
It's, it's been a difficult track, uh, going way out of my comfort zone. We did. We have moved probably in the last 5 years, about 80, 000 bottles of the product. It looks, looks like this and, uh, we have, uh, we do no advertising. We do no social media.
Leighann Lovely: We
Bill Maher: might, we might, I think we found somebody though, it's going to help us with that.
But all we want is word of mouth. It's it. We have 4700. Uh, roughly 4, 700 customers that we, that we know of their subscribers. Right. Um, we probably needed 20, 000 to, to, to have a, you know, and we're, we're moving toward it, it's, uh, people are starting to realize what this product is. And, and I, one of the things that used to scare me is, uh, and, or hurt my feeling, I was expecting somebody to say, oh, [00:30:00] that stuff's no good or whatever, whatever, but we have five star, a hundred percent, five star ratings about the quality of the product and what it does, people write like stories in the, in the reviews about.
You know, got rid of my acne, I had a stye in my eye, I sprayed it and it was gone the next day. Um, it's anti aging, it's um, yeah, it's a fantastic product, so if it wasn't so good, I would have quit it five years ago. But I, people, what happened to me, what happened to me, I can tell you a little bit about what happened to me when COVID came out.
There's 50 years of science behind this product. It dates back to the 1800s. A scientist couldn't figure out how do we heal ourselves inside? How do we heal our burns, cuts? How do we get rid of the cold? How does it go away? What is it? And they found that the electricity and the salt and water in your body combine to make hypochlorous.
So he would, he's, he, the scientist, I can't remember what his name is, but he was a French scientist. He [00:31:00] used electricity and water and salt to make it. So it's been around for a long time. Um, I, uh, you know, looking back about the, um, uh, about what what happened to me with the FDA is terrible because I didn't know anything about the FDA rules and regulations.
And I knew looking at the government National Institute of Health studies over the last 50 years proved that this stuff is absolutely off the charts, right? So when COVID first came out, somebody must've known in Tampa at the news station and said, Hey, hypochlorous, we got to find somebody who's make this hypochlorous.
That's all I can't figure out any other way. They called me one day and they said, you, you manufacture hypochlorous. And I said, yes, they said, well, we'd like to interview you. And I said, okay, but I can't make any claims. So don't ask me anything about claims. And so, and they said, okay, so I came over, it was a great interview.
After the interview, we were selling like products were going out. The door is [00:32:00] incredible. All local, right. Well, when they did the interview and I looked at it, they, they, uh, put a guy in there from the University of South Florida, who's a doctor. They edited him, his interview in with mine, and they asked him about hypochlorous.
And he said, Oh, it kills COVID, kills all the viruses, blah, blah, blah. And then the FDA came after a little old me. You know, in a little office, it was this big, you know, and, and, uh, they, they, I said, well, can I, uh, I'll stop. I won't make any claims, but can I get this tested? It's already been tested, but can I test it myself and get Google during this pandemic?
Because it could really help you out a lot. And they said, don't waste your time. We'll never approve this. Right. So, um, and then what they did was they put a warning. If you go on Google to search for my company, you'll see the, you know, the company here. If you scroll to the bottom, it's an FDA warning that will never come off.
And that's, that's what ruined the company. Basically, it hurt the company bad or bad, and they'll never take it off
Leighann Lovely: an FDA [00:33:00] warning saying what
Bill Maher: we made fraudulent claims about, about type of chorus and COVID. We didn't make any claims.
Leighann Lovely: You didn't right. I was to say you didn't make any claims. That was
Bill Maher: a desperately did not want this out because with a with a nasal passage cleanser, uh, and a skin spray.
Um, well, I don't have to tell you, you can make a guess what that was. It is. It is so safe. That if you, it's just water, salt water. Basically, if you spray it, you can spray it in your mouth
Leighann Lovely: in
Bill Maher: your eyes. You can put it anywhere you want. It's, it's organic. It's natural. Right? So it's nothing going to hurt you, but it's been proven to be 80 times the virus killing power of bleach.
Leighann Lovely: And yet it is a hundred percent natural. So you don't have to deal with the fumes of bleach. You don't have to deal with the chemicals. You don't have to deal with the, all of the things that come along with using a harsh product. Alcohol or, or some of the,
Bill Maher: they use in [00:34:00] restaurants, uh, they use, uh, you know, the, uh, the, um, a lot of bad chemicals and the stuff they use restaurants to clean tables and things like that.
So, so people are starting to understand it now. And we're in the word of mouth is going from, I mean, word of mouth is incredible. It's not.
Leighann Lovely: And this is where it, where, where our world is, is broken and government can come in and basically say, don't believe them. And everybody goes, well, if the government saying it, right.
So you, what is your future look like? And you know, that was kind of your 32nd pitch as far as the product, um, cause we are coming to time, but I want to give you the opportunity to also tell me, what is your future look like in this? Thanks.
Bill Maher: Well, uh, you know, I'm, I'd like to find at some point, I'd like to, to, you know, sell, sell the company when I retire, go do things I want to do for a change without having this on my, a lot of stuff like this on my back, um, or, or attract a [00:35:00] partner that might want to invest and be a marketing person that would might, might want to invest so that we can grow that part of the company to get to where the EBITDA is enough to get a good price for the company.
Um, but I'll stay here as long as I have to. You know, I'm going to, I've already committed myself to two more years, so I don't want to go too much further than 72 years old when I, you know, with doing this kind of stuff.
Leighann Lovely: Well, you, it's, you have built an amazing one. Sounds like an amazing product. Um, where can somebody reach out to you to one, check out your product, purchase your product, learn more about it, and you know, how would they go about doing that?
Bill Maher: Well, our, our website is curative obey. It's C. U. R. A. T. I. V. A. B. A. Y. curative obey dot com. And, um, you can get us, you can reach us on email at [00:36:00] info at curative obey dot com. And if you really want to get ahold of me, I answer the phone at 7 to 7, 7, 4 to 6, 6, 3, 6. So, that's.
Leighann Lovely: And that information will be in the show notes.
So if you are looking to reach out to learn more about, um, you know, bill, you're looking to reach out to learn more about curative obey. Um, definitely go ahead, check out the show notes. You'll be able to find that information there, but bill, um, you know, your journey has definitely been one that is amazing.
Um, and I really appreciate you coming on and talking with me today.
Bill Maher: Okay. Well, I appreciate the time.
 

Balancing Sales and Leadership in Luxury Real Estate Market

In this engaging episode of "Love Your Sales," Leighann Lovely chats with Andy Daro, a seasoned real estate professional and commissioner of North Bay Village in Miami, Florida. Andy shares insights from his 12 years of experience in luxury sales, discussing the unique challenges and rewards of managing a successful real estate team. He also delves into his role as commissioner, focusing on community development projects like the Island Walk. Listeners will gain valuable advice on balancing sales and management responsibilities and the importance of hard work and personal growth. Tune in to discover how Andy navigates the world of high-stakes real estate while juggling multiple roles
 
Contact Andy
Website – compass.com/agents/the-daro-team/
compass.com/agents/andy-rotondaro/
LinkedIn – linkedin.com/in/andy-daro-b7838471
 
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Leighann Lovely: Welcome to another episode of Love Your Sales. Um, I am joined today by Andy Daro. Andy is the commissioner of North Bay Village in Florida, Miami, Florida, and the founder of the Daro team at Compass, a leading real estate team in South Florida. With over 12 years of experience in luxury sales, Andy has established a reputation For exceeding exceptions and building lasting relationships within his [00:02:00] community. I am very excited to have Andy join me today. Welcome to the show.
Andy Daro: Hi, Leighann. I'm excited to be here. Thank you for having me on your show.
Leighann Lovely: Yeah. So why don't you expand on that, that brief intro and tell us a little bit more about yourself.
Sure. Thank you.
Andy Daro: Sure. Um, I lead a team, as you mentioned, at Compass, uh, located in Miami. There are nine, uh, of us on my team, uh, international. We deal mostly in luxury residential sales, condominiums, and single family homes, uh, a lot of them waterfront in Miami, Florida. And also, uh, recently I've became commissioner, as you mentioned, of North Bay Village, which is a 9, 000 island, um, 9, 000 resident, sorry, island community in the middle of, uh, the heart of Miami Bay between Miami and Miami, Florida.
Leighann Lovely: Wow. Okay. And how, how does one become commissioner and [00:03:00] what is that role?
Andy Daro: Well, it's an elected position. Uh, so it is, uh, elected, uh, as I mentioned, though, we have a, it's a small island, so there's only about 9, 000 residents. Um, and it's a, it's a four year term and I'm currently serving my second year. Um, as commissioner.
Leighann Lovely: Okay. And so what, what are some of the responsibilities with that? And forgive me for being naive.
Andy Daro: Sure. No, it's a, it's a local municipality. So, um, there's been a lot of, especially in Miami where Uh, the kind of crossroads with my real estate is we currently have a lot of development happening into the area.
So it goes from development laws to development agreements, uh, planning and zoning. Um, but then it also ranges as just kind of anything that happens in our community, from our infrastructure projects, uh, to our school, our police department, um, funding and budget, uh, anything [00:04:00] that goes into running a city.
It's a board of five. So I'm, you know, and then of course we have a great team at North Bay Village, uh, that are employed by the city. Um, so it's a big, it's a group effort, uh, but it's, it's been a good experience so far.
Leighann Lovely: Yeah. Awesome. So let's, let's talk a little bit about you. So you're with what, 12 years of experience in luxury sales.
So and you run a team of, of nine. So let's, let's talk, let's dive into that. You know, tell me a little bit, well first, I guess before we get into that, let's, let's back up. Have you always been in sales? Have you always been in the real estate kind of industry?
Andy Daro: I have mostly always been in sales. I've been in fortune 500 sales, corporate sales prior to getting into real estate, which you mentioned was about 12 years ago.
It was in New York city. And I was licensed two years as a realtor in New York city before coming down to Florida. Um, I [00:05:00] have now been here in Florida for about 10 years and I started my team in 2018. So, uh, maybe about what's that six years now I've had my, my own team running.
Leighann Lovely: Okay. And how does one go from New York to Florida?
I mean, those are very different landscapes,
Andy Daro: is it? But yeah, um, there's actually, I mean, actually, it's one of the most common routes, I think, for relocation in the United States. Uh, New York to Florida is very common. And my My, well, I always kind of envisioned myself being in South Florida, but I came, uh, to, I was working with a team from New York when I first started real estate and they were looking for a representative for the Miami area.
Uh, and that, that was what originally brought me to Miami.
Leighann Lovely: Okay. And let's talk about the different type of sale that must be. I'm assuming. I mean, that's got to be a [00:06:00] very different.
Andy Daro: It is. I always found it much easier in Miami. I mean, we have beautiful weather all year round. We have better tax policies.
Um, it actually, it's sold for much less than New York City. Now that gap has been changing. over the past 10 years, you know, we've seen such a high increase, uh, in the cost of, of real estate in South Florida, in Miami. So I think the gap has closed some, um, but nonetheless, yeah, uh, I've always, you know, New Yorkers have always gravitated to investing or coming to live in Miami.
Leighann Lovely: Right. I mean, you go from SkyRise, you know, buildings and not all of New York, I suppose. I mean, depending on where you are, there's beautiful parts of, of every state where you can get out into. But when we hear New York, we think of all of the flashing lights, the, the city that never sleeps, the, the tall, you know, SkyRise buildings, that kind of thing.
But, [00:07:00] so tell me what, and when you got the itch to run your own team?
Andy Daro: I yeah, it You know, it kind of happened naturally. Um, it started when I was still working with the team from New York and I kind of, You know, was able to our business was growing down here and I had the freedom to hire, uh, one agent, you know, to come under us here.
And then it became a 2nd agent and we were working as kind of a team of 3 at which time we were with the Corcoran group. If you're familiar, it's a large agency in New York. Uh, and in 2018 was when, you know, we kind of positioned or 20, you know, during the pandemic, um. Um, when we started to switch over to Compass, uh, which is where I've been for the last three years and is where we've kind of expanded our team from three agents under a New York umbrella to our own team down here in [00:08:00] South Florida.
Leighann Lovely: And so tell me, you know, how that, how that shift evolved and, um, you know, what your, uh, you know, are you running the team? the operations on that? Are you still out there day to day selling? Are you really a little
Andy Daro: bit, a little bit of both? I mean, most of all of the team that I manage are Sales agents themselves.
So I carry a little bit of a sales manager role, but of course I am still heavily involved in sales myself. That is still my priority to be out there, closing deals, um, finding new places for my clients at the best deals that we can do.
Leighann Lovely: So what would, I mean, do you, do you like wearing both hats? Do you like the managing of the sales?
Also doing the sales? Do you, what is the, because, and I ask this question [00:09:00] because often they say a great salesperson struggles to also manage. Or to really manage a team.
Andy Daro: Uh, that's a good question. Again, I think, you know, the growth kind of happened organically. It wasn't something, it was on a need basis.
And as our, our brand kind of expanded, more people came to us asking for opportunities that were a good fit. Um, but the management role itself, uh, there are certain days where I would agree, um, it kind of takes you back from growing your own personal sales as a person, you know, where you're helping others grow.
Um, so there is a part of that, but I, I enjoy it. I'm, I have all great people that work for my team. So I'm very lucky to have such, you know, everybody is very high energy. They're all, uh, you know, they're all able to carry their own, uh, Workload without needing such a, a micromanagement, uh, manager to kind of show [00:10:00] them the way.
Um, you know, I think that's, I think that's important and, and kind of takes off a lot of the work of a manager so I can still kind of just focus on doing what I do best and that I still think is, uh, is selling.
Leighann Lovely: And that's, that's awesome. And so I guess. When you say what I do best and, and here's what I'm going to dig in on Andy.
Andy Daro: Sure.
Leighann Lovely: So again, me being a salesperson and often I've been told in my life, Hey, you're really, really great at selling. So stay in your lane, right? And people will say that like, if you're really great at selling. Don't become a manager, but it sounds like you found a balance of being a, cause you have a team of nine.
That's nothing. A team of eight include or nine, including you.
Andy Daro: Yeah.
Leighann Lovely: Semantics. Yeah. That, I mean, [00:11:00] it is hard to jump from salesperson to manager. To manager and I'm making a, you know, putting on a different hat type, but to be able to, and, and let's not forget the commissioner of the North Bay village. So you're, you're juggling a lot.
Andy Daro: It's, it's certainly time consuming. And I think you are absolutely right. When you talk about the balance, which I think I am still. Learning, you know, I think I'm still finding my highest level of efficiency. Um, but on that note of efficiency, perhaps you're right. I mean, when you're, when you're talking about just trying to gross the highest level of personal sales, I think if I stayed an individual and didn't kind of grow the brand, or, you know, there is something that.
Is to be said about maybe it would be best just being able to focus on yourself and only having to deal with their own problems. But at the same time, I think, you know, [00:12:00] I've learned that through teams, we can do so much more, uh, so that we've been able to grow our volume number wise. Um, and able to also kind of delegate and prioritize, I think is very important when you have a team so that, you know, I haven't been always.
Brought down with the same type of administrative issues, which take up a lot of time. Um, you know, we want to help everybody. We want to work with everybody. So, you know, I never, I never like to say no to people. So it's, we're able to help more people this way. Um, so I think that that part of having a team has led me to be able to grow my business, but definitely finding that right balance is important and something I'm still working on.
Leighann Lovely: Well, that's, and it's good that you recognize you're still working on it. Some people think, Hey, I'm great at everything I do, right? But it's that, that constant evolving. So if you are going to talk to somebody and give them advice on how to hone [00:13:00] in and get better, what do you, you know, do you have anything in place where you're like, you know, checks and balances on your own personal growth?
Andy Daro: Hard work. I mean, what's the only thing we can actually control is being able to put in the work as a salesperson, being able to put in the effort, being there, being present, willing to, you know, go the extra mile for your, your clients. I think this is really the only controllable in, in what we do. Yeah, I mean, so much.
Uh, there's so many variants that happen. I mean, interest rates, uh, you were dealing and especially in real estate, you know, you can't control everything. There's so many emotions that go into it where, uh, there's so much of people's personal lives that get involved, you know, half of what we do with sales and real estate.
Um, it is considered sales, but I think it's so much different than other types of sales. We aren't, for example, uh, Always handling three [00:14:00] objections, you know, this is like something that they teach you in sales and when they're trying to sell you something, well, what about this? Or what about that? And it isn't always that way.
When you deal with real estate, you really have to understand people's feelings, uh, what they really want to achieve. And that is the sales process in real estate, um, which I think differs from a lot of other sales that I did prior to getting into real estate
Leighann Lovely: because you're selling. Well, because ultimately, somebody is coming to you saying, I'm, I'm ready to buy.
Usually they're pre approved by a bank. Well, they should be, right?
Andy Daro: Yes. Hopefully.
Leighann Lovely: And so they already, they already have their dollar amount. And so you're working with them on a emotional level, and I'm going to, I'm going to guess that there's a lot of emotions that are running high, running low, [00:15:00] running all over the place, especially, you know, and, and I'm going to pull from my parents were in real estate.
So I'm going to pull from, you know, my years of listening to that and my experience in buying my own house. You know, you put in a, an offer and now you're all bundled up in like, I want this and if it doesn't go through,
Andy Daro: yeah, you feel a bit responsible. You always want to, you know, especially when you're working with a client on the buy side, as you've been mentioning, uh, You know, you don't have the, as persuasive as I can be, I don't, you know, you don't have the full ability.
Uh, if somebody else is out there in this instance where you manage, you know, you're managing a client with, uh, uh, pre approval or who's plans to finance, if somebody else is coming in with a stronger cash deal, I don't think there's anything that I can say at this point that would make a seller [00:16:00] wish to, you know, accept our offer.
Which has a lower probability of closing, you know, unless we were willing to pay an over asking price, um, which is, you know, that that is one of the situations, uh, You know, that that's definitely where you aren't in control, um, on the buy side and, you know, and if half of the time, uh, we're on the sale side dealing with the sellers, you know, and there's a whole different set of emotional circumstances when you're working with a seller and their home, whether they're being emotionally connected to a place where they've raised the family or, you know, there's so many different things that can go into it.
Um, that you're, you're always dealing with this in real estate. Um, but that's, you know, I, at the same time, that's, but that's part of the job that, that we enjoy. So,
Leighann Lovely: right. The emotional side and most sales
Andy Daro: people.
Leighann Lovely: Right. Dealing with people. And, and, and most consumer sales of some [00:17:00] have emotion tied to them.
You know, it's obviously for going into an extremely large corporation as a salesperson pitching to a board of directors, it's very non emotional, um, in the sense that, well, you have a product they have, but people buy an emotion justify it. on logic at the end of the day. I mean, that's, yes,
Andy Daro: I, I, I think that's, I think that's correct with, uh, well, yeah, uh, yes and no, uh, there's still a lot of logic and I think numbers that go into real estate.
I mean, you always have to have the right value, the right price per square foot. So there is this numerical sales component to, to what we are doing, but the additional Um, that I don't think is if you're selling medical devices, so to say, uh, is all the emotional, personal, um, intertwines that that are involved in real estate and making real estate deals happen.
[00:18:00] Uh, Sometimes I call myself a firefighter, you know, and they're like, what are you doing? I'm a firefighter because you're just constantly, uh, solving issues or putting out fires is what, you know, I think I spend half of my time doing is just, uh, problems will arise in real estate. How can you deal with that and keep people, um, level, you know, from not wanting to do, uh, to do stuff, cancel a deal or, or move elsewhere in another direction.
Leighann Lovely: Right. Interesting. A firefighter, right? Well, anybody who's, you know, an operationally, you know, on the side of sales, but it's pretty much what they are. Right. Hey, go to work. I'm going to go up pretty much put out fires all day long as my clients are calling me and they need this or they need that or some deal is blowing up in our face.
Right.
Andy Daro: So some deals are definitely easier than others, but I always say that I, in 12 years, I don't think I've had one [00:19:00] easy deal where everything just goes smooth. So there is always some, uh, expect the unexpected,
Leighann Lovely: right? And you still are in it, which means you're okay with that.
Andy Daro: Yeah, I'm still here. Um, yeah.
So I've had a, an ability to endure it or that, or we have, uh, fortunately we've had some success in the recent years, which always makes it easier. Um, when you are closing deals, it will get you through, uh, the, the ones that don't go your way.
Leighann Lovely: Right. Right. Absolutely. So obviously the real estate industry, and I guess you being in luxury sales, it's been Probably not as impacted as just the general because.
People who have money, have money, have money.
Andy Daro: I have
Leighann Lovely: money.
Andy Daro: I think that's accurate. Yes. Uh, in South [00:20:00] Florida and Miami, we deal with a extremely high percentage of cash deals. Something like over 50 percent of the deals that we do are, are cash and they're often, uh, multi million dollar deals. So yes. Um, I think in down economies or in situations like we're experiencing now, Uh, on the domestic level where we're hearing that interest rates are really high.
You know, I think that unfortunately, you know, these interest rates are affecting more of our middle class who are reliant on getting a mortgage to purchase their their home and whether it's 3 percent or 7 percent makes a huge difference. But, uh, when you're dealing with the cash buyer, there is that quote, unquote luxury to just be able to.
Purchase with cash and not be reliant on a bank to make the deal that you want.
Leighann Lovely: And what, what better industry to be in that it, the dips and valleys [00:21:00] don't, aren't as reliant on the state of the economy because you're dealing with a population that they have money regardless of whether the economy is high or low, because.
Andy Daro: Well, I mean, it seems that way. Uh, Miami is, uh, some people say it's not a real place. I mean, the amount of wealth that you see coming to here, often it isn't made in here. Uh, now we do have For the first time, we're experiencing a lot of corporate relocation. Um, seat to Dell Amazon. A lot of the tech companies are starting to come to Florida.
So I think we are going to see a lot more jobs and a lot more wealth creation being made in Miami. But I think this is all this is all something new for the city. It's. historically been known, I think, as a place where you vacation or maybe have a second home. But I think that there's a whole new, um, and [00:22:00] again, spared by the pandemic of people living here with their primary residence and choosing to call Miami their home.
Leighann Lovely: Interesting. And, you know, we, we see different flexes of, of that happening in different cities from time to time. Um, do you see that continuing to, I mean, you're, you get the first indicator, right?
Andy Daro: I do think it will continue. Uh, At the level that it's been continuing where you've seen in some cases prices up 30 40 percent year after year.
Is that sustainable growth at some level? I would have to say no, nothing can continue to grow at the level that's we've been experiencing in South Florida. But do I see a reason that the market should be as cyclical as it's been in the past or prices crashing? No, I think there's still a very high demand to be in Miami.
We're still experiencing a lot of relocation. And so far, the [00:23:00] people that have moved here, uh, have not been wanting to leave here, you know, so there's still, they're not going back to New York. Like a lot of people have said in my experience, well, once the pandemic is over, then they'll be back. Uh, so far in my experience, that, that hasn't been the case.
Leighann Lovely: Interesting. And, and you, the pandemic definitely shook up a lot of, you know, I mean, a lot of people relocated to, um, a lot of different places. Um, you saw a lot of people leaving California, um, the L. A. area. You saw a lot of people leaving and going to places that maybe were more lenient on
Andy Daro: Ubi. Policies may be lenient, uh, and definitely tax friendly.
I would say this has to be, uh, a big part of it. So it goes in, um, I think the largest is that. A lot of people started [00:24:00] working from home also in the pandemic. So I think this kind of spirited. And when you're no longer going into an office, why are you going to justify paying a 10 percent tax to your state when this is no longer mandatory?
Or, I mean, it's not mandatory in the sense that you're working from home. So, uh, whether your home's in New York or California, or in this case, Florida, uh, there is a difference to your take home, even though you're working.
Leighann Lovely: Absolutely. And I, I, you know, I live in, in the state that I live in, I'm in one of the highest tax, you know, as far as the property tax that I play or
Andy Daro: find you, Leah, can we find you a place in Miami, Florida?
Leighann Lovely: I don't know. I think that might be outside of
Andy Daro: podcasts. I'll give you, I'm sorry. Usually I have a much better background. I'm in my office today, but I'll get you a beautiful ocean view in the background for your podcast. I think it would be, [00:25:00] I think it would be great.
Leighann Lovely: That's awesome. Will you fly me out there on your dive to look at homes?
Andy Daro: Yeah, we'll talk about this.
Have you ever been sold yourself, Leighann, on your podcast and they try to sell you their own product? Yeah, this is Again, it happened naturally. It wasn't my plan either, but this is Right.
Leighann Lovely: That sounds amazing, though. I would love, I would absolutely love It really is. I mean,
Andy Daro: that's the easiest part of selling Miami.
I've always told people it kind of It has the ability to sell itself. Uh, we live in such a beautiful place here. It really is amazing to be home here.
Leighann Lovely: Yeah. And I love, I love Florida. I visited there many times. Um, my, my other favorite place is, is, uh, you know, San Diego, California, but here's the, here's the thing is that I don't have to write well, and I wouldn't, I work from home, so I wouldn't have to drive anywhere.
I can't stand traffic. So when I have to go to the grocery store, I want it to [00:26:00] take me two minutes. To drive there and 2 minutes home.
Andy Daro: Yeah, that
Leighann Lovely: is my only and I don't want to become one of those people that never leave my home and have to order groceries.
Andy Daro: Yeah, that's a good point. I also, uh, love a walkable community.
I think this is a great. Um, and there are plenty of, you know, I think South Beach in Miami or Brickle, if you're familiar with this neighborhood, they do have this walking community. But one of the main things that as I switch hats here and I talk about my role as a commissioner that I am working on as commissioner is really improving the walkability of our island.
Because I think, you know, that people really like this and that you don't have to get into a car to go to your supermarket or a restaurant or to go get your coffee. So we are Definitely one of the roles that I'm looking to play in our community is to improve our walkability, um, not just with our, our sidewalks and infrastructure, but we're also having an amazing project we call called the Island Walk, where we're building a waterfront, uh, walkway [00:27:00] for a waterfront boardwalk for our pedestrians.
So we have about, uh, it's one square mile, our Island, and we're trying to connect most of the areas that have commercial zoning all by this route called the Island Walk.
Leighann Lovely: Wow.
Andy Daro: Yeah, that
Leighann Lovely: see that just that seems like a dream to me. This
Andy Daro: is the dream for me too. Yeah. Uh, and a lot of it is, um, time. Yeah, it's time consuming isn't right where we're waiting.
I mean, there's a lot of development that's coming and it's a lot of it is reliant on the new developments that are coming, which are helping us build the infrastructure. So there's a lot of public private, uh, collaboration in, uh, Seeing this dream fulfilled. Uh, but I do think that the pieces are in motion and in about five years time, I think we'll really start to see some of the benefits of the work that we're putting in now.
Leighann Lovely: That's amazing. So, um, we're, we're coming already. We're coming to time. So I want to give you your, um, I give [00:28:00] everybody their 30 second. Shameless pitch. Um, but before I do that, I want to ask you one question. Um, you know, as, as a sales. As a sales professional, as a manager of people, as a commissioner, if you had to give advice to your younger self or to somebody who's coming up, um, seeking, you know, what do they want to do with their lives?
Do they want to go into sales? Do they want to go into real estate? You know, what advice would you give to some of the younger listeners?
Andy Daro: Oh, this could be, uh,
Leighann Lovely: I know it's a broad question, isn't it?
Andy Daro: Yeah, but, uh, I mean, getting into sales is something I wish I did earlier. Uh, and I'm not even sure, you know, college is a great path for some people, but I don't think it's for everyone, especially if you need to be in this entrepreneurial sales role, you know, I think we were built to kind of go.
Uh, college is where we wanted to go corporate and there are certain things [00:29:00] where, of course, you'll need this education to do, but I don't think it, you know, if you have your heart set on being a salesperson, um, it really just comes down to your personal, uh, work ethic, you know, what you're going to put into it.
Um, and especially in real estate, you know, I could have, if I could have gotten going on in my career 10 years earlier than I did, um, that would have been something that if I went back in time, I would have just done from the time I was 18, I would have been in real estate, uh, but I'm happy. I found it, uh, still later in my twenties.
Um, you know, so it's, uh, I, I got there in time, but, um, maybe that's some advice I would consider, uh, as my earlier self.
Leighann Lovely: That's awesome. And now your 32nd shameless pitch and how people can reach out to you.
Andy Daro: Sure. Uh, again, my name is Andy Daro. Um, the leader of the Daro team at Compass. We do sales for residential in Miami and Miami beach.
And if you're happening to listen to this podcast today and you [00:30:00] have interest in South Florida real estate, we'd love to help you out. So, uh, please feel free to get in touch with me and we'll find you your home down here.
Leighann Lovely: And Your website, will be listed on the, show notes. That's and andy Daro.com.
So you are welcome to reach out that way. Is there another way that you would like to me to reach, reach Out? Yeah, that's a
Andy Daro: personal website that'll connect to me, but, uh, if you, Andy Daro at Compass, um, if it Google, it'll, it'll find its, it'll find itself, um, as, as well on Facebook and Instagram.
Leighann Lovely: Awesome.
Perfect. Andy, this has been such an amazing conversation. I really appreciate you coming on and joining me today.
Andy Daro: I enjoyed talking to you. Have a wonderful day. Thank you.